Hello all of you gritty males....

Well, you'll never believe this but I have been smitten - fallen in love with Bothys turbo RAV. You would need to see it to believe it!!

I have managed to buy a car from Aberdeen which has a turbo engine - I think they call it a 3SGTE? The car itself is being sold as an insurance write off, but I have managed to ask the garage people who worked on Bothys car to do mine as well. And yes, I have bought a low mileage 'M' registered RAV4 3 door in really nice condition.
I spoke to a young man today who showed me his Fiesta and I was really taken!

So, sometime in the next 6 weeks, I hope to have my speedy tool !! The turbo car, which the young man said is called a donor car - a bit like a blood donor - is being delivered next week. I can hardly wait!

My younger sister Simonina will be really jealous. Its a beat up old Mercedes which broke down in Italy somewhere.

[quote name='Nettie McKenzie' post='709967' date='Jan 9 2008, 10:22 PM']Its a beat up old Mercedes which broke down in Italy somewhere.[/quote]
What is?

[quote name='T600' post='709977' date='Jan 9 2008, 11:10 PM'][quote name='Nettie McKenzie' post='709967' date='Jan 9 2008, 10:22 PM']Its a beat up old Mercedes which broke down in Italy somewhere.[/quote]
What is?
[/quote]

I am not very sure which comprehensive school you went to if you got that far sir. I thought the grammar layout would have made it plain that it is Simoninas' car which broke down. I found it quite hilarious, but then I had a Grammar School upbringing in one of the better establishments and so I realise that I may well have a very dry sense of humour. I am sorry if I thus confused you. I will attempt to keep my posts to words of less than 2 syllables in future.

Then again, I suspect you would make a very good Member of Parliament.

Did they teach you what a split infinitive is?

[quote name='Nettie McKenzie' post='709986' date='Jan 9 2008, 11:26 PM']I am not very sure which comprehensive school you went to if you got that far sir. I thought the grammar layout would have made it plain that it is Simoninas' car which broke down. I found it quite hilarious, but then I had a Grammar School upbringing in one of the better establishments and so I realise that I may well have a very dry sense of humour. I am sorry if I thus confused you. I will attempt to keep my posts to words of less than 2 syllables in future.

Then again, I suspect you would make a very good Member of Parliament.

Did they teach you what a split infinitive is?[/quote]
Please don't take offence so easily.

At no point in your post did you mention that Simonina even had a car. The last car you mentioned prior to the word "Its" (sic) was the donor car, therefore it seemed possible that you thought you were going to get a 3S-GTE out of a broken down Mercedes. I now see that by "Its" you meant "your sister's car".

You're wrong actually about my education, I'm sure your wrong about my potential to be an MP, and yes thanks I do know what a split infinitive is, though I have no idea what the relevance of that is to either your post or mine.

Carry on.

no... hang on a moment before you carry on nettie please

I just need to scratch my balls a bit more before you continue thanks. After that I need to make a small miniature statue of the taj mahal out of chinchilla chewed wood shavings, then I'm back with keen interest.

Should be about a week

[quote name='T600' post='709999' date='Jan 10 2008, 12:23 AM'][quote name='Nettie McKenzie' post='709986' date='Jan 9 2008, 11:26 PM']I am not very sure which comprehensive school you went to if you got that far sir. I thought the grammar layout would have made it plain that it is Simoninas' car which broke down. I found it quite hilarious, but then I had a Grammar School upbringing in one of the better establishments and so I realise that I may well have a very dry sense of humour. I am sorry if I thus confused you. I will attempt to keep my posts to words of less than 2 syllables in future.

Then again, I suspect you would make a very good Member of Parliament.

Did they teach you what a split infinitive is?[/quote]
Please don't take offence so easily.

At no point in your post did you mention that Simonina even had a car. The last car you mentioned prior to the word "Its" (sic) was the donor car, therefore it seemed possible that you thought you were going to get a 3S-GTE out of a broken down Mercedes. I now see that by "Its" you meant "your sister's car".

You're wrong actually about my education, I'm sure your wrong about my potential to be an MP, and yes thanks I do know what a split infinitive is, though I have no idea what the relevance of that is to either your post or mine.

Carry on.
[/quote]
I am sorry. I can see where you are coming from.
My little bit about split infinitives proves that you would indeed be a good M.P.! It would be nice to have someone in the Houses of Parliament who actually knew what they were doing and why!!

Then we could have a supporter to drop the fuel taxes?

[quote name='Jinxed' post='710003' date='Jan 10 2008, 12:32 AM']no... hang on a moment before you carry on nettie please

I just need to scratch my balls a bit more before you continue thanks. After that I need to make a small miniature statue of the taj mahal out of chinchilla chewed wood shavings, then I'm back with keen interest.

Should be about a week [/quote]
It is interesting that you come from Wigan. An interesting place indeed - a dump on one side and beautiful on the other. There is a small group of men there who restore classic cars - I had a very rewarding visit to meet them 4 years ago.

If it takes you a week to find them (balls), I would helpfully suggest that you visit your GP to arrange to have them lowered. It is not uncommon for them to still be stuck high up -but it is a fairly painless operation to have them lowered by a surgeon. 40% of males in Wigan have had this problem so I was told.

As regards your other hobby, it must be very rewarding!

Nettie

Congratulations on your new find. I thought you and bothy might get on well together but I never thought you would be quite so taken with the size of his camshafts. Take care with his steak pie it is loaded with malt whiskey and when he slips into his scottish self he can be quite a cad (he is quite safe while he has a split personality but must be avoided if he develops a third).

I hope you keep a better photo journal of the conversion than bothy did and try to get me that autograph of the proclaimers when they do it for you.

As for surgeons, I don't think caviar will help what mother nature can do when the weather warms up or at least that is my excuse.

Out of interest I had a proper council estate childhood and went to an approved school.

Regards

[quote name='Nettie McKenzie' post='710024' date='Jan 10 2008, 07:49 AM']If it takes you a week to find them (balls), I would helpfully suggest that you visit your GP to arrange to have them lowered. It is not uncommon for them to still be stuck high up -but it is a fairly painless operation to have them lowered by a surgeon. 40% of males in Wigan have had this problem so I was told.

As regards your other hobby, it must be very rewarding!

[/quote]

lmao surgeon. Gravity and Neutonian physics did that. As for 40% of males in WIGAN LOOOL I dont live there LMAO So well done! As we are on the subject of generalisations, perhaps(helpfully) you should save the money on doing anything to your car so you have enough to OD on a moose size dose of Heroin and battered mars bars. You can save us from your school teacher attitude and apparent wish to be seen as an intellectual; whilst saving the environment from dragging your likely fat carcass around in that 'stupid persons' land rover. Oh sorry hang on, I just read you live at work wherever the heck that is.

Kind Regards

[quote name='Jinxed' post='710065' date='Jan 10 2008, 10:36 AM']'stupid persons' land rover. [/quote]



The boys are on their way to Wigan

Ahm no jist a wee bit peeved by sum wans comments o the RAV being a landrover. Well thats the way I take it. If the young chap thinks he's got a fast car, then I'm afraid there's a mistake. Ma RAV will bury the MR2 no bother. Dinna git me wrang....the MR2 is a nice looking car but its *****e at handling on the road. Ah ken that frae the nummer that are written aff. The balance is aw wrang and the spare wheel is aff a pram. Ye probably need 2 hefty guys up front tae keep the wheels oan the grun??

Ah won the race between me an a bran spankin new Audi R8 - out accelarated the laddie at all speeds up to 115mph. Cos ma men hadnie finished the rear suspension balancing/stiffening a let the mannie awa aifter 120mph!!!!!! If ma RAV dis 100mph in 4th at 4000rpm; ahd reckon 180mph is well within reach wance ah've turned up the boost tae gie me anither 60bhp!

MR2s are nice as they say. Good fur shoppin at waitrose or whitever shops ye have - dinna carry twa much but. The new wans aw seem to be wumins cars but tae.

3 Door RAVs are fkn out of this world, properly looked aifter. Ah widnae bother owr waste yer time tryin me fur a race - different league ma man!

[quote name='bothwell_buyer' post='710125' date='Jan 10 2008, 02:19 PM']Ma RAV will bury the MR2 no bother.[/quote]

Firstly, to be rather generous in explanation, my generalisation was aimed at nettie; but I understand the effect of using one so for the reasonable, my apologies But then nobody(stick your pretentious grammar lesson for starting a sentence with 'but' nettie k please) is concerned with the caustic, insulting, pretentious cack that I think nettie confuses with humour. so....

For those that would like a little demonstration....

Thank you Bothwell, and no bother here either. Which Mr2's will your rav bury exactly? Are you assuming everyone has standard 2's by any chance and yours is the only modified van in the world? ding! Thank you for fulfilling the criteria. Oh and btw if what you mean about racing an r8 was after 115 he left you... technically he won ding ding maybe because because your van was broke lol but he still won. whether its an inch or a mile a wins a win.

Personally I despise people who behave in a condescending fashion towards others, who in all innocence either speak to them or are required to deal with them. I certainly will not defend them. So anyhow have anice day and forget about it. I stay away from the rav part usually anyhow and only get drawn here when theres an interesting topic on the homepage. So dont let me work your nerves, be responsible for your own feelings after all I'm here on the principle I watched someone who is ok get a very condescending reply, I'm responsible for that and I'm quite happy to own my stuff. Do likewise!

Kind Regards

Nettie, you dont seem to have adhered to the Rav forum protocol. All new members
are asked to post a photo of their Rav in the Rav 4 photos thread started by a member
called Bob King. But then you dont actually own a Rav do you ? In fact you are not female
either are you ? Or Scottish, in fact I find it quite puzzling that you have chosen the Rav
route to noise up whoever your intended victims on TOC are, being that we are all nutters
on here another would not look out of place. So if you wanted to draw attention to yourself
you have obviously chosen the wrong forum. Maybe we should start a campaign to unmask you.

nettie mckenzie aka the stig

Good try dave, but I think she real, and about to join the select RAV turbo club. Though I'm never sure whether Bothy's for real anyway

Bothy are you going to be entering your vehicle into the Toyota Sprint Series then?

I'm sure they'd welcome you, but I suspect there are quite a few vehicles in there that you'll be pushed to beat, including one or two N/A Mr2s.

Unless you're allowed to take short cuts across the infield that is.

My goodness!

Things seem to have livened up here have they not? Then again, I suppose men live such dreary lives that they will respond to any stimulation.

I did try to load a photograph of myself wearing a lowish cut summer dress to my profile page. However the site would not allow me. I assume this will be due to the fact that I have not paid a subscription fee.

I do indeed own a RAV. 3 doors open onto a well kept interior. The car is almost like new despite it being 14 years old. Almost as old as my son in fact! I will post pictures of it on this forum in due time. I have 1 photograph of it, but will arrange to have some more flattering pictures taken.

However, it is time for dinner, so I must rush. Douglas does not having his dinner late.

[quote name='Nettie McKenzie' post='710176' date='Jan 10 2008, 06:04 PM']Things seem to have livened up here have they not? Then again, I suppose men live such dreary lives that they will respond to any stimulation.[/quote]

I guess if bleeding from your crotch once a month, getting cranky, and externalising everything is exciting yes we possibly do

[quote name='Jinxed' post='710200' date='Jan 10 2008, 09:40 PM'][quote name='Nettie McKenzie' post='710176' date='Jan 10 2008, 06:04 PM']Things seem to have livened up here have they not? Then again, I suppose men live such dreary lives that they will respond to any stimulation.[/quote]

I guess if bleeding from your crotch once a month, getting cranky, and externalising everything is exciting yes we possibly do
[/quote]

I was actually thinking that nettie and bothy had met their match for a while but don't forget that we have other ladies visit and to be quite honest that's rather unpleasant.

Lets keep it friendly guys.

Agreed

Afterthought though.....

If Bothwells little list at the side is the rough extent of his mods.... how the heck is he sooooo sure that his rav is diferent league altogether to a car that in one revision actually came with the [b]mk2[/b] 3sgte turbo lump as standard, with many of the uk and imports being modded to some extent and mr2's which have been modded upto insane levels?

on a sidenote, I'm expecting my ability to care to be delivered by royal mail tomorrow morning.... theres hope yet

if he's just very optimistic I can accept that

Kind regards

[quote name='Jinxed' post='710247' date='Jan 10 2008, 09:04 PM']Afterthought though.....

If Bothwells little list at the side is the rough extent of his mods.... how the heck is he sooooo sure that his rav is diferent league altogether to a car that in one revision actually came with the [b]mk2[/b] 3sgte turbo lump as standard, with many of the uk and imports being modded to some extent and mr2's which have been modded upto insane levels?

on a sidenote, I'm expecting my ability to care to be delivered by royal mail tomorrow morning.... theres hope yet

if he's just very optimistic I can accept that

Kind regards
[/quote]
Haw jimmy. Fur reasons o simplisticity and lack o space, then not all the mods are listed by any means.
The following has been translated into normal known English:

If the machine out-performs an R8 up to a speed which is well above normal RAV ability, then it is merely an indication that a lot of time has been spent on the mechanical side. There are 5 similar RAVs throughout the world - so its not exactly a classic or straightforward improvement, and certainly not one you can just buy from a Toyota specialist garage.

If I wanted to speed along a motorway which has had its plane - ie its flatness - laid to handle speeds of 70 to 100mph, then its completely foolish to attempt speeds above that. Probably the reasons why Top Gear use an airfield or racetrack for speed tests - its because the surface has been designed to allow such speeds. (I am friendly with a Civil Engineer who is a world specialist on road technology & knows quite a lot about these things).

There were 2 guys who were racing each other, on the M74 which is right behind my house. The undulation in the road surface was fine up to 100mph but they went above that. Both crashed and 1 was killed. So its not a case of winning - its a case of knowing limitations. And a case of paying some respect to others using the road.
Another example was a good friend of mine who was killed instantly after a lorry had to cut a corner as the road surface could not accommodate the speed and the lorry could not meet the cornering requirement. So maybe what I'm trying to say is that vehicles are built to meet specific criteria in given circumstance.

My RAV has been built for acceleration - obviously as the original gearbox is being used which was designed to provide low gearing so to be able to handle mild off-road work. For a short wheel base, as it is, it is remarkable at fast speed on straight line and cornering. It also has to be road legal...I've seen non-road legal MR2s which could outperfom the RAV in certain uses. However, the RAV has been set up currently to handle all road possibilities. This may well change if we start to take the engine up a few horsepower but as we are treading new ground, then we develop step by step - same as the guys with drag MR2s.

The mechanics I use are highly qualified and know the 3SGTE engine and its potential. The main mechanic has an original mini which, apart from being lowered, looks standard. Its won a number of class awards for the power being put through the wheels and would easily out perform the RAV. But he can't take it onto the road when the road is wet!

So there we have it. I could have gone down the route of an MR2 upgrade, but then I just like to be different. One of a class of 5 in the world different.

cheers and have a nice weekend.

Bothy, I knew your RAV was fine machine, but if it "out-performs an R8 up to a speed which is well above normal RAV ability" then I'm amazed.

The R8 weighs 1560Kg, has a power output of 414bhp resulting in a claimed 0-60 of 4.6 seconds, though testers report that they've achieved 4.3 seconds with it. That's much faster than a Porsche Cayenne S for example which only achieves 0-60 in 6.1 seconds with a similar horsepower.

And I believe that some standard RAV4s are good for about 120 to 130 mph, so by implication you were still faster than the R8 'well above' that speed.

Have you really achieved that kind of performance from a two litre 4x4; if so, then hats off to you.

[quote name='T600' post='710380' date='Jan 11 2008, 10:40 AM']Bothy, I knew your RAV was fine machine, but if it "out-performs an R8 up to a speed which is well above normal RAV ability" then I'm amazed.

The R8 weighs 1560Kg, has a power output of 414bhp resulting in a claimed 0-60 of 4.6 seconds, though testers report that they've achieved 4.3 seconds with it. That's much faster than a Porsche Cayenne S for example which only achieves 0-60 in 6.1 seconds with a similar horsepower.

And I believe that some standard RAV4s are good for about 120 to 130 mph, so by implication you were still faster than the R8 'well above' that speed.

Have you really achieved that kind of performance from a two litre 4x4; if so, then hats off to you.[/quote]
In relation to the R8, it comes down to power to weight ratio. I'm guessing just now that my RAV is not much more than 1000kg, with an engine power output of soon to be 300bhp. We think its running around 240bhp just now but once tuned up further, we'll take proper measurements. The 3 door 2000 RAV was about 1280kg - heavier than the 1994 model.

Taking the 1994 model, we've taken out the back seats; replaced the front with Cobra Monaco which is a big weight saving; the wheels are lighter weight 18" alloys running 245/45/18 tyres so there's weight saving there. The front discs have been replaced with larger but lighter KAD discs; the calipers are KAD 6 pot which are much lighter and lightyears better than the originals;the 3SFE has of course been replaced by a twin cam 3SGTE; the exhaust is custom built straight thru which is lighter etc;and theres been a lot of work done on the suspension (ride height maintained as original), with some weight savings. Other non-essential bits have been removed.

So I suppose we're running at 2/3 of the R8 weight with about 3/4 of its power giving an overall power:weight advantage.

Then the RAV gearing comes in - its the original 5 speed with the 1st gear set to allow some off-road work without having to have a low gears box ala Landrover fitted. 2nd gear is a bit of a jump up. I think the top speed of the original spec RAV was 105 but it wasn't too stable above 90.

The combination of all we have done adds up to a stable lightweight short wheelbase with the engine sitting fractionally behind the front wheels and the weight of the transmission providing some middle balance. Making assumptions on the power of the 3SGTE and rpm max, then a top speed of around 185 seems theoretically possible.
The next planned work is to source and produce a lightweight rollcage; turn the boost up and reset the electronics; and to tweak the wheel alignment with a new wizard tool as we have a slight disturbance on the suspension. The rollcage will have an effect on the p:w ratio and centre of gravity so I need to minimise that.

At present, on the road with the conditions we have been enjoying, I'm getting 0-60 of less than 5 seconds with still more time to be shaved if I really pushed the car properly. Those who have tried the car, step out and the first words are OMG!

Certainly the car is quite happy to tootle along at 110 without any obvious strain, sitting at around 4000rpm, with the turbo barely trying.
Hope this proves interesting to some of you. I'm developing an area on one of my websites where a slideshow can sit, and a video once we do some time trials.

[quote name='bothwell_buyer' post='710393' date='Jan 11 2008, 11:52 AM']Hope this proves interesting to some of you. I'm developing an area on one of my websites where a slideshow can sit, and a video once we do some time trials.[/quote]
Certainly is interesting. I'd been expecting the weight to be much more than that.

Look forward to the website.

Not particularly into vehicles of this type myself due lack of opportunities to use them to the max, but certainly impressive engineering and a nice change from the lardy 'Off Roaders' that clog up our village at school times every weekday.

Thank you for typing in English so much easier to read and grasp.

ok so in a race up a craggy mountain your rav would do better than a low slung car... sounds reasonable.

Then you start talking about how its geared towards acceleration... which made me think 'so its top end has probably been sacrificed' somewhat....

Then you start on about how its been tailored towards multiple different types of surface and conditions.... which made me think about multi role fighter bombers and how they are jacks of all trades but excel at none, with specialist platforms designed to perform one role doing it very well... moreso than multi roles.

Essentially, you may have upgraded TO a 3sgte.... some mr2 owners upgrade FROM a 3sgte. As for what MrT will do for its customers. When I asked them(my local) if theyed fancy overhauling an mr2 with a MUCH more powerful engine, turbo, transmission, nos, the works etc with a target figure of around 1000bhp... they actually gave an excited yes to the idea.

I guess if you want to compare your rav to standard cars then your going to be quite happy as the 3sgte engine has had the word 'Legendary' attached to it by many people and it is a damn fine engine, though there are more powerful ones. When you start to compare it against other modded vehicles then I guess its just a jeep with a better engine and some other bits. Afterall you never know what the guy next to you has under the hood, unless you get shown

kudos for doing a massive overhaul to it though. You have a nice day also mate

Kind regards

Cheers

Having to be a road car at present restricts work that one would do for a race track. As far as the RAV is concerned, the engine compartment is very restricted - probably more so than an MR2 which obviously I've worked with, and with Celicas which I've seen.

If it'd been bigger then the Jaguar 5.3 could have been slotted in and transmission courtesy of USA...but as the intention is not a 5 door RAV, then thats not an option.

The point I was making about road surface is that roads up in Scotland are 95% unsuitable for speed much above 140mph. Those that can are parts of the M74 and stretches of the A9....not much else. We're not blessed with miles of motorway or good quality straight roads such as those down south - perhaps historic as the Romans didn't do much road building up here...?? So Knockhill is the option.
As you say, the 3SGTE can be modified way past 500hp - to do this on a 4 wheel drive transmission system would mean a substantial change to the existing kit and for little gain due to the power/weight strengths and lightness of the car.

The high powered MR2s I've seen are interesting but wholly unsuitable for road use in my area - The bottom end would be ripped out with half a mile unfortunately. The garage I use has done drag racing using the 3SGTE, and very successfully, but as you say, the cars are set up only to do this.