Handbrake Completely Useless After New Pads & Shoes

[Thumper427]

Hello all,

Looking for some advice here as I'm not too clever with cars yet!

Got a Corolla GS Auto, 1995 vintage. Had new front pads and rear drum shoes done today and now the handbrake is utterly useless, it wasn't great before but it did hold the car on a decent hill, now it's completely ineffective on a slight slope! Got the MOT in 2 weeks so need to know what's what.

Will this bed in or is something wrong? Is the handbrake auto adjusting on this model? I'm led to believe the car is a Jap import, I am struggling to find any information online and I don't have a manual for it either.

Any advice would be great thank you :)

[oldcodger]

Hi,

First off, have you have the work done by a garage for by yourself ? - if by a garage go straight back to them as they should have properly tested their work before handing to you.

Assuming you have done it yourself the most likely causes are adjustment, wear, and contamination.

Adjustment, would assume your drums are self adjusting and a few pulls on the handbrake lever and presses on the brake pedal shoud take up the slack, though the handbrake cable might need manually taking up at the handbrake lever. ( normally about 5-6 clicks for fully on)

Wear, how worn are the drums ? is there a distinct groove in the drum the width of the shoes ?

If so then the new shoes might only be making contact with the 'high' areas and need to be 'worn ' in though that probably means ---

Have you measured the internal diamenter of the drum contact surface, has it worn too large ?

The minimum diameter is usually stamped /moulded on the drums surface.

Contamination, have you left traces of grease on the shoes or drums ?

Lastly, are the new shoes the right ones ?

If you buy a servce manual like the Haynes it details everything you need to know about servicing the brakes and specifications.

[Thumper427]

Hi oldcodger,

Thank you very much for your detailed response. I tried to keep my first message brief but I'll go into more detail now.

I did not do the work myself, it was a garage, a very good one I've been using for years. I was made fully aware of the handbrake issue and was happy to take the car home as I need it so I won't lay any blame on them.

The car was test driven afterwards and the mechanic did pump the brakes and repeatedly put the handbrake on and off but it didn't seem to do anything. He did say to bring it back for manual adjustment if it did not improve, he didn't know if it was auto-adjusting or not. I just can't figure out if the car has an auto adjusting handbrake? Any ideas how I can find out? I have ordered a Haynes manual but will take a few days to get here.

The drums were considered in good condition with regards to wear, no grooves, no contamination, no need to replace, a new fitting kit (springs etc) was put in with the rear shoes.

I'm a bit concerned about purchasing the right shoes though. I had major problems trying to find out what model the Corolla is. Like I mentioned I think it may be a Jap import, indicators on the right, total lack of info on the inernet for it. On the V5 it just says Toyota Corolla GS Auto 1995 (1.3). When I came to buy the parts from Eurocarparts they were asking me if it was a 12v, XLI 16v, XLI and other variations and I don't have a clue!! Eventually the guy "used a database" and just said it was OK he found the right parts. Were they right though, I have no idea as every single parts shop had trouble identifying this cars exact model to find parts?!!

Finally, I have tonight tried to take the plastic surround off where the handbrake is so I could look at the cable. I can't even get that damn thing off. I've undone the 4 screws on the outside (no centre glovebox) and it doesn't want to come apart where the split is around the auto stick. This car is not only infuriating me but also garages and parts suppliers so any help would be very welcome, I am happy to PM the VIN or reg if that would help too.

Thank you :)

[Cyker]

I reckon the handbrake cable just needs adjusting.

Does the handbrake work even slightly? Maybe they didn't re-attach the cable properly...?

[FROSTYBALLS]

I believe the trim levels for the UK 1995 Corolla were (in ascending order) - Sportif, GS, CD, Si, CDX. As far as I remember the Sportif replaced the XLi. The 1332 4E-FE engine was 16 valve.

As regards the indicator stalk being on the right, that is actually the correct set up for right hand drive vehicles - the change to having the indicators on the left, only happened from the 1970's onwards because manufacturers like Ford, Vauxhall,etc produced a standardised layout for Europe to bring productions costs down.

The last car we had with the indicator stalk on the correct side was a Honda Concerto we bought new in late 1994.

[oldcodger]

Hi,

Right, so it sounds like you have bought the parts yourself for your garage to fit.

When replacing the shoes they should have compared the shoes against the old ones to ensure they were the right type.

(I would assume there would be a noticable difference if they were the wrong type)

Before you adjust yor hand brake you really need to ensure the rears are working correcltyv for normal foot pedal braking which I would think the are not at the moment.

( really need a rolling road to test that)

When you get that book it should show you how to manually adjust the rear shoes, basically jack up the back end and spin the wheel by hand, can you hear the shoes binding, no, then on the outside of the drum there is usually a little access hole that allows you to click back the internal adjuster, move it and test again, repeat until they just start to bind then back off one notch.

One you have done that run a few miles to bed in and then check adjust the handbrake.

First, how many click does it take to get the handbrake lever to go up to maximum ? aim for around 5-6 for fully adjusted.

( the handbrake adjusment does not affect the brake pedal movement)

Removing the centre console, not sure about you partic model but generally after removing all screws /bolts the front part is held together by clips moulded into the two parts, carefully run a thin blade/ screwdriver around the join until you feel the clip and then carefully spring open.

[KenMavor]

http://www.toyodiy.com/parts/q.html

Whack VIN into this parts number and see what the make up looks like. Will show you the part numbers for brake parts and so on and might show you if there is a brake adjuster or an automatic one. You will have to register and sign in to see the pictures. Worth a look.

[Thumper427]

Wow, thank you so much for all your help.

For starters, that website is great KenMavor, here is the information it gave me;

Market

Europe

Year

06/1995

Make

TOYOTA

Model

COROLLA

Frame

EE101

Vehicle characteristics

GRADE: XLI: XLI TYPE DESTINATION: EUR: EUROPE BODY: HB: HATCHBACK DRIVER'S POSITION: RHD: RIGHT-HAND DRIVE ENGINE: 4EFE: 1300CC 16-VALVE DOHC EFI TRANSMISSION: ATM: AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION GEAR SHIFT TYPE: 3FC: ATM, 3-SPEED FLOOR SHIFT NO.OF DOORS: 5D: 5-DOOR COLOR CODE: 6P0 TRIM CODE:

I've registered on that website but I cannot see any pictures or anything, I searched the site and still couldn't find anything.

I also tried to use the part number cross referencing tool, I put the rear shoes number in there and it just came back with nothing, same for the brake pads. The shoes I got from Euro Car Parts, yes I ordered the parts myself as ECP had a 50% discount on for braking components which was way cheaper than even trade price the garage could get, part numbers for the rear shoes are;

102820018 Pagid

112820028 Pagid (I think this one is the fitting kit)

The foot brake seems to work fine, obviously the pads and shoes need bedding in but it stops!

The handbrake goes up 9 clicks, it's really slack, no tension there at all.

Interesting about the indicator stalk, I didn't know that being on the right was actually correct! :)

Thank you for the information on the trim, I'll go easy with it and see if I can tempt it free with a bit of persuasion and then I can hopefully have a look at the cable and see what's going on there.

Thank you so much for the help so far, any more would be great! I can also take pictures of anything if that helps too.

*edit to add*

I rang Euro Car Parts and the shoes and pads were absolutely 100% the correct parts.

I really can't get that plastic handbrake surround off, can't get the thinnest flathead screwdriver in there at all so I give up with that. Took a couple of pictures to show where I think it should come apart and doesn't (obviously all 4 screws were taken out when I was trying to get it off);

[Parts-King]

Helen

Do not be so easy on your garage, they should never have sent out a car with the handbrake not working

I would return the car to them and get them to sort it out. For the mechanic to say he did not know if it was automatic adjust or not is just a fob off, he should know and I would change your garage, that is just not good enough. It may well be an adjustment issue, but they should be sorting it out for you. Go back and have it done urgently

I can now remove my sunglasses, now that I have scrolled down the page away from those hideous seat covers

Kingo

[KenMavor]

Agreed with Kingo........get the garage to check.

Looking at the parts pictures there are two cables to work the hand brake connected to a single cable from the handbrake itself inside the car. Looks like manual adjustment available on all three cables but suspicious that it doesn't do anything. Wonder if the cables have disconnected when they did the brakes. Get the garage to check. Up on a ramp very easy to see and test the brake cables.....doing it at home it is a pain in the a......

[Parts-King]

The procedure should be........Back off all adjustment at the cables. Adjust the shoes at the drum (manual adjustment of the automatic adjuster to just allow the drum to turn freely) THEN adjust the cable so the lever comes up 5-7 clicks

You should not have to tell the garage this, they should never have sent it out in what is an ILLEGAL handbrake (not working) they should know how to adjust it. Personally I think there will be more to this than meets the eye, take it back right away and have them sort it out

[Thumper427]

Thank you every one once again for taking the time to help me, I really appreciate it a lot.

I will call the garage first thing tomorrow morning and get it back there asap, I wouldn't attempt to mess with it myself as I don't know what I'm doing especially without the manual yet, plus I can't even get the handbrake surround off! I just wanted to see the cables to see if they were slack. Have driven the car a fair bit today and been using the handbrake a lot more, at every opportunity I can and it's not getting tighter at all. I can actually lift it all the way back which is 12 clicks, it gets tight after 9 clicks but even at 12 the car still rolls on a slope. I'll wait with the car so I can see what goes on and what the problem is, plus that means I get to learn things too. I shall let you know what happens!

Thank you everyone :)

[oldcodger]

Hi,

As I said originally and Kingo confirms the garage should not have returned your car like that.

As Kingo also says, think you are missing some info ..? is it that the 'mechanics' are some mates doing you a freebie at work ..?

If not and you have paid for the work and its now worse than when you took it in, then they most correct it , FOC for labour; though to be honest if you have paid I would perfer to find a different / better garage !

[Thumper427]

Yes the mechanic is a friend, he is very good, has been looking after my cars and motorbikes for years now, he runs a bodyshop so it's not like he's a plumber, my vehicles have always been maintained to a very high standard by him, it's just this time it's got a bit wrong. I accept that a mistake has been made and I don't feel angry about it at all because he did tell me about the handbrake and said to bring it back if it didn't get better (re: auto adjusting) and everyone makes mistakes, it's not as if he gave me the car and said nothing about it. It's really difficult when it's someone that's a friend who you respect involved. Had it been a service centre charging me hundreds I wouldn't be so 'chilled out' about it. Yes I did pay for the work, mates rates.

Sorry about the seat covers they were a gift, it's like that terrible jumper you get at Christmas but have to wear it to avoid a confrontation! The seats are covered in water marks so at least it hides those... while I'm here... any ideas on if you can get water marks out of the seat fabric? :)

[Thumper427]

Car is in at a different garage today as original mechanic not responding to me. 2 of the springs on the rear offside drum have come off and something which I cannot remember now, he said something has come un-wound to do with the handbrake, plus nothing has been lubricated so that needs doing too. He's going to take apart the rear drums both sides and re-fit everything as he said the job wasn't particularly good, hopefully nothing is damaged and needs replacing, so far if it's that simple it's £90+VAT to fix. Really unhappy but at least it's getting fixed. Thank you everyone for all your help it has been greatly appreciated, harsh lesson learnt as well.

[oldcodger]

Hi,

Good to hear you have got things sorted finally. :D