Tyre recommendations - Auris T Spirit 5dr 1.8 VVT-i Hybrid

[Kojac]

REG: 2010

 

Hello All,

First post after signing up!

I'm hoping for recommendations / info / knowledge - regarding choosing replacement (all 4) tyres.

This car does little motorwar driving - mainly dual carriageway on the evenings (tescos and the such) and the odd trip to cornwall from london 3 times a year.

It's for my ol' lady - who drives about 20 mins to and from work everyday.

I would really appreciate any contributions that would help me build knowledge in this area.

215/45 R17 87W

Don't like bargin bucket type tyres - mid range is where my mind is on this.

P.S

Are LLR tyres relevant here?

Also - purely out of interest - what were the OE tyres on this model from factory?

 

Many thanks to all that choose to contribute,

 

Kojac

[FROSTYBALLS]

OE fitting in this size were Michelin Primacy HP RP GPNX tyres - which, as far as I'm aware, weren't LRR.

[Heidfirst]

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/accessories-tyres/91856/tyre-reviews-best-tyres-20152016

You can buy Continental ContiSportContact 5 215/45 R17 87 W FR from ~£80 delivered, fitting,valve & balance is probably ~£10-12 per wheel.

The Contis probably won't be the quietest, most fuel efficient or hard wearing - if  you particularly value any of those choose a tyre that is biased towards those features (& probably doesn't perform quite as well in other qualities because of that).

[Beekeeper D]

Michelin Cross Climates? Excellent wet grip, decent economy, lowish noise ... £90 ish each total via blackcircles. Anything better? 

[Kojac]

 

15 hours ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

OE fitting in this size were Michelin Primacy HP RP GPNX tyres - which, as far as I'm aware, weren't LRR.

FrostyBalls,

 

Thank you for replying.

Hope it's okay for me to ask how you can be 100% sure. After 5 calls between Toyota head office, the Twickenham dealership plus one other (with them all contacting/coordinating with each other) still couldn't answer the same question! 

 

14 hours ago, Heidfirst said:

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/accessories-tyres/91856/tyre-reviews-best-tyres-20152016

You can buy Continental ContiSportContact 5 215/45 R17 87 W FR from ~£80 delivered, fitting,valve & balance is probably ~£10-12 per wheel.

The Contis probably won't be the quietest, most fuel efficient or hard wearing - if  you particularly value any of those choose a tyre that is biased towards those features (& probably doesn't perform quite as well in other qualities because of that).

Heidfirst,

Thanks for pitching in. We won't be having a separate set of winter tires.  Would you still recommend these under those conditions or something else?

 

55 minutes ago, Beekeeper D said:

Michelin Cross Climates? Excellent wet grip, decent economy, lowish noise ... £90 ish each total via blackcircles. Anything better? 

Beekeeper D,

Thanks for your suggestion - They have great reviews but seem a little expensive.

--

It seems that the manual only recommends tires with a 87'W load index.

On black-circles, the selection of the same tire -  but with the 91'W load index instead - is much better. There are many more brands, and many more tires to pick between.

However - I am concerned about how picking a 91'W would affect both handling and then my insurance coverage? Can anyone weigh in on this?

 

Also why would Toyota not recommend LRR tyres for this hybrid? Surely it could only improve mpg values? 

 

Genuinely appreciate the input from all those that are contributing,

 

Kojac 

[FROSTYBALLS]

"FrostyBalls,

Thank you for replying.

Hope it's okay for me to ask how you can be 100% sure. After 5 calls between Toyota head office, the Twickenham dealership plus one other (with them all contacting/coordinating with each other) still couldn't answer the same question!"

I have access to a Toyota spreadsheet (which is subject to regular live updates by Toyota) which provides tyre fitment information for Toyota models manufactured between 2008-2014.

[Heidfirst]

5 hours ago, Kojac said:

Heidfirst,

Thanks for pitching in. We won't be having a separate set of winter tires.  Would you still recommend these under those conditions or something else?

Do you need winter tyres in Kent?  If you think that you could use some extra grip for snow/ice etc.  but don't want a separate set of winter tyres go with the Michelin Crossclimates (or equivalent Goodyears, Nokians etc,).

It seems that the manual only recommends tires with a 87'W load index.

On black-circles, the selection of the same tire -  but with the 91'W load index instead - is much better. There are many more brands, and many more tires to pick between.

However - I am concerned about how picking a 91'W would affect both handling and then my insurance coverage? Can anyone weigh in on this?

You can go up load index OK (but not down) although the ride may become a bit harsher as the sidewalls will be less compliant

 

[Kojac]

6 hours ago, Kojac said:

 

It seems that the manual only recommends tires with a 87'W load index.

On black-circles, the selection of the same tire -  but with the 91'W load index instead - is much better. There are many more brands, and many more tires to pick between.

However - I am concerned about how picking a 91'W would affect both handling and then my insurance coverage? Can anyone weigh in on this?

 

Also why would Toyota not recommend LRR tyres for this hybrid? Surely it could only improve mpg values? 

 

Genuinely appreciate the input from all those that are contributing,

 

Kojac 

FROSTYBALLS,

 

Could I please ask for your input on the above please - especially about the insurance implications of going up one level on the load index.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Don't think there were many (if any) tyres produced which were specifically low rolling resistance and low profile. Toyota may not have had much choice but to fit 'standard' rather than LRR tyres for cars fitted with 45 profile tyres. Think around the best scoring tyre in your tyre size merits a C rating for fuel economy (rolling resistance).

As regards the Load Index, according to the British Tyre Manufacturers Association, UK law does stipulate replacement tyres must have a Load Index equal to or higher than the original fit tyre. So going from a tyre with an 87 load index to a tyre rated at 91, will be fine.

Tyres with a higher load index will probably have stiffer sidewalls as a result of their higher load index. So there may be a harder ride - but it may not be that noticeable. 

[yossarian247]

As above,  load index, like speed rating, has no insurance implications if you go higher than standard. The only issues can be if you go lower than standard. 

[eygo]

when i had my CT200h i used dunlop sport maxx rt in the 215/45/17 size they where a great tyre quiet economical good stopping aswell

here is a link for national tyres

https://www.national.co.uk/tyres-search?Width=215&Profile=45&Diameter=17&Rating=&LoadIndex=&ExtraLoad=1&Brand=Dunlop&WetGrip=C&FuelEfficiency=C

[Kojac]

2 hours ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

Don't think there were many (if any) tyres produced which were specifically low rolling resistance and low profile. Toyota may not have had much choice but to fit 'standard' rather than LRR tyres for cars fitted with 45 profile tyres. Think around the best scoring tyre in your tyre size merits a C rating for fuel economy (rolling resistance).

As regards the Load Index, according to the British Tyre Manufacturers Association, UK law does stipulate replacement tyres must have a Load Index equal to or higher than the original fit tyre. So going from a tyre with an 87 load index to a tyre rated at 91, will be fine.

Tyres with a higher load index will probably have stiffer sidewalls as a result of their higher load index. So there may be a harder ride - but it may not be that noticeable. 

 

2 hours ago, yossarian247 said:

As above,  load index, like speed rating, has no insurance implications if you go higher than standard. The only issues can be if you go lower than standard. 

Thank you all for posting.

Firstly,

I would ask if anyone can help me open this load rating/insurance issue up a bit more.

I have already send of a enquiry to admiral insurance asking about what their view is on this - but I am not optimistic that it will end up in-front of the right person with the right technical/legal knowledge to answer accurately.

Could anybody point me to some further sources which back this up - and could be used as a reference when talking to admiral via phone. There are so many articles claiming that if you don't buy tyres - as exactly as specified in the handbook - your insurance becomes void.

You've guessed that I like drill down to the facts - so that it becomes part of my knowledge base too. And I am a stickler for quality sources.

 

Secondly,

If it doesn't affect my insurance - clearly higher load rating tyres will have some sort of affect on the handling and breaking of the car. If the tyres are made for a heavier car - would this affect braking distance and grip with a lighter car. Also - would the recommended PSI need to be changed?

[FROSTYBALLS]

Extract from a personal message sent earlier:

Extra Load (XL on the sidewall of the tyre) or Reinforced (RNF) would have stronger sidewall construction or an extra layer within the carcass of the tyre, and some are also available with Rim Protection  built into the sidewall (a ridge on the sidewall intended to help prevent alloy wheels from being scuffed against kerbs - the ridge gets scuffed instead). So for example with tyres which have a load index of 91, one can also have tyres which are 91 XL and 91 XL RIM PROT.

The one drawback may be that the ride may be harsher with XL tyres, but the car may handle better due to less flex in the sidewalls. However there may be a slight adverse effect on fuel consumption.

The air capacity in a specific size tyre with a load index of 87 will be virtually identical to the capacity of the same size tyre with a load index of 91. An XL tyre may have a small decrease in the air capacity, due to the different construction of the tyre.. An increase in tyre pressures should only be necessary if you were carrying heavier loads (which you're not) - otherwise, whether you go for standard 91 tyres or 91 XL's, I'd keep to the same pressures as now.

[yossarian247]

This is worth a read:

Important considerations - The British Tyre Manufacturers' Association (BTMA)

Do bear in mind that the load index is simply the maximum load that a particular tyre can cope with. There is no problem at all with subjecting them to a lower load than the maximum,  and no change in braking distance, or different tyre pressures required. 

Although I would certainly notify my insurers if I was changing to a different size tyre than the original,  I personally would never contemplate mentioning an  increase in load index. They will tend to either a) not care, or b) have no idea what you're talking about 

[Anthony Poli]

Hi Kojac,

One option that has been chosen on here, is to go for 225 45 R17 tyre size. Which should give you more to chose from. I fancied the cross climate ones but they are not in the original size, but if i choose the 225 45 R17 instead of 215 45 R17, then I can get the tyres.

If only budgeting for them was as easy

[Mooly]

I recently (February) had four new Dunlop Blue Response Sport tyres fitted by the AA at home. I chose the tyre from their site basing my choice on fuel efficiency and noise level. The Dunlops got top ratings for both. There were around 30 or more tyre choices offered but the site was easy to navigate. All in price was just under £260 and I was very pleased with their work... air cushions used for the lifting and torque wrenches were used. The balance seems perfect at speed on the motorway.

    

[eygo]

at 70mph you will be travelling at 71 mph which technically is illegal as your speedo cannot indicate a speed that is lower than you are travelling at.

 

[Heidfirst]

14 hours ago, Anthony Poli said:

Hi Kojac,

One option that has been chosen on here, is to go for 225 45 R17 tyre size. Which should give you more to chose from. I fancied the cross climate ones but they are not in the original size, but if i choose the 225 45 R17 instead of 215 45 R17, then I can get the tyres.

If only budgeting for them was as easy

you need to inform your insurer of a tyre size change - depending upon insurer they may or may not vary the premium (some, like Toyota-branded insurance Aioi Nissay Dowa, will not cover any changes from standard spec.).

[unclepoo]

With 215/45 17 tyres, the speedo over reads by quite a large amount......fitting 225/45 17 tyres will make the speedo slightly more accurate. A taller tyre will give a little more comfort and wider will give more grip, if you are comparing the same tyres from the same manufacturer. 

[FROSTYBALLS]

21 minutes ago, unclepoo said:

With 215/45 17 tyres, the speedo over reads by quite a large amount......fitting 225/45 17 tyres will make the speedo slightly more accurate.

Legally this isn't relevant.

According to speedometer calculators, fitting 225/45/17 tyres in place of 215/45/17 tyres will result in a slight under-read, which is illegal.

UK regulations as regards speedometer readings are as follows:

In the UK, the speedometer must never show an indicated speed less than the actual speed. UK regs differ slightly from EU regulations in specifying that for all actual speeds between 25 mph and 70 mph (or the vehicles' maximum speed if it is lower than this), the indicated speed must not exceed 110% of the actual speed, plus 6.25 mph.

For example, if the vehicle is actually travelling at 50 mph, the speedometer must not show more than 61.25 mph or less than 50 mph.

[Anthony Poli]

I think people have not understood the tyre size, the 215/225 is tyre width and this will not cause any change in speedo accuracy. If you were to change the profile from 45, which changes the radius and circumference and that would change the vehicle speed. Going for wider tyres that has a greater rolling resistance  will impact fuel economy not speed.

Speedometers are supposed to over read than under read, this is confirmed by reading the OBD data and satellite navigation, or passing a speed control zone.

 

 

 

[FROSTYBALLS]

12 minutes ago, Anthony Poli said:

I think people have not understood the tyre size, the 215/225 is tyre width and this will not cause any change in speedo accuracy.

No - have used two UK based speedometer error calculators, and both show an under-read for the 225/45/17 tyre when compared to the 215/45/17.

[TomdeGuerre]

1 hour ago, Anthony Poli said:

I think people have not understood the tyre size, the 215/225 is tyre width and this will not cause any change in speedo accuracy

The aspect ratio is given as a percentage of the tyre width.

A  215 x 45 x XX" has a sidewall height of 45% of 215mm

A 225 x 45 x XX" tyre has a sidewall height of 45% of 225mm

thus the rolling circumference is greater with the 225 width tyre and affects the speedometer reading as Frosty says.

[unclepoo]

Check with the mph on a sat-nav....the standard tyre size over reads on the speedo by 6-7 mph at 70....this is why the mpg figures are optimistic too. Fitting a size larger tyre is slightly more accurate.

[FROSTYBALLS]

24 minutes ago, unclepoo said:

Check with the mph on a sat-nav....the standard tyre size over reads on the speedo by 6-7 mph at 70....this is why the mpg figures are optimistic too. Fitting a size larger tyre is slightly more accurate.

Not relevant.

If the change in tyre size makes the speedo under-read, it is illegal.