Driving automatic car - tips?

[YarisHybrid2016]

The pawl is a mechanical lock inserted into the transmission, so I'd expect it to break off if the wheels are forcibly rotated.

 

[johalareewi]

Creep is inevitable with an autobox..

Toyota hybrids do not have a conventional autobox and there is no natural creep.  For the hybrids MrT decided to simulate autobox creep.

[johalareewi]

13 hours ago, YarisHybrid2016 said:

The pawl is a mechanical lock inserted into the transmission, so I'd expect it to break off if the wheels are forcibly rotated.

Looking at the picture, if the cog turns against the pawl, the teeth are likely to get stripped before the pawl breaks.

[YarisHybrid2016]

That's even worse! 

[kithmo]

1 hour ago, YarisHybrid2016 said:

That's even worse! 

Nah, there's loads of teeth to go at on there 

[Beekeeper D]

Note that the parking pawl engages with the notched disc not the gearwheel. 

The only function of that disc and pawl are to stop the transmission rotating. 

It is not putting a "spanner in the works" to jam a gearwheel that does other work. 

In the picture with the red arrows (seemingly a Subaru and non-hybrid transmission), the pawl engages with the castellated wheel at top centre, not the "final gear" at lower right. 

 

Before "the wheels were forcibly rotated", there would have to be enough grip between tyre and road to break the pawl or disc, which I think is unlikely. Something like the pawl in the upper picture is going to be much stronger than the tyre grip - the car would simply slide over the road rather than 'forcibly rotate" wheels and "strip teeth" off that unit. 

 

HOWEVER, with americans and their massive pick-up trucks (with pure mechanical connections between shift lever and pawl) and sloppy driving habits, the seemingly-common habit of slamming the thing into P while it is still moving will inevitably cause accelerated wear on the parts, and ultimately increased likelihood of failure.

The risk to the pawl in the transmission would be minimal in a rear-end shunt. You (or rather the insurers) would have plenty other things to worry about. Being a small risk even if that rare situation should ever occur, ought to make that a very minor concern. 

 

There is another misinterpretation through this thread - the repeated use of the phrase "high intensity brakelights". 

There's no such thing. (Apart from some Volvo idea for 'emergency stop' automated warning...)

Brakelight brightness is regulated by the Construction and Use Regulations. It is limited by law to what is tolerable to closely-following (queuing) traffic. 

Perhaps the confusion is caused by the term "high level brakelights" - which means "high-mounted for better visibility", not brighter. 

The only "high intensity" rear lights are rear foglights (only for use in poor visibility conditions - fog, heavy spray or falling snow), which should never be used in stop-start traffic, and the abuse of which is something I personally do find thoughtless, annoying, fatiguing, distracting and thus unsafe.

 

The Toyota HSD transmission, with its push-button computer-mediated electronic actuation of the parking pawl cannot really be compared with the lever-operated pawls common in traditional auto boxes.

Whether you choose to stay on the footbrake at traffic lights, or shift into P or even N, is honestly NOT an important aspect of driving a Toyota HSD automatic.

Not leaving the thing in N for any length of time (use P) is however an important and perhaps not immediately-obvious HSD consideration.  

There may be arguments as to finessing the very best traffic light technique as a compromise between the different considerations, but that's all it is - its not exactly an important (let alone essential) consideration for a new-to-HSD driver, and the compromise that best suits one driver is unlikely to be chosen by all.

I would suggest that learning how to take advantage (where provided) of the hill-start-assist is rather more important. 

Unfortunately, I discover that use of the P button is an old argument ... as this 2013 thread illustrates!  

 

[MEP's Yaris GS]

On 7 September 2016 at 8:02 AM, RUToyota said:

Creep is inevitable with an autobox.. I simply "cover" the foot brake and/or go to N and use the parking brake if I need to.

Not so, there are plenty of Auto's out there which don't creep.

 

Toyota's HSD system wouldn't normally creep if it wasn't a feature put in to please those who wanted it. I'd far rather it not be there personally, but each to their own.

[PeteB]

50 minutes ago, MEP's Yaris GS said:

Not so, there are plenty of Auto's out there which don't creep.

Toyota's HSD system wouldn't normally creep if it wasn't a feature put in to please those who wanted it. I'd far rather it not be there personally, but each to their own.

I'm with you.  My ex-partner had a Mk2 Nissan Micra with CVT and that didn't creep - I used to steal it for trips into London as it was much more relaxing in traffic than the Volvo automatic I had at the time.

I think the Tesla solution is best - an option in the set-up screen on the centre MFD - the user selects whether to have creep or not.  There's absolutely no reason why Toyota couldn't adopt this for their Hybrids - it's a simple software setting.

I can sort of understand why they wanted to make traditional auto drivers feel at home when the original Gen 1 Prius was launched, but that was almost 20 years ago (20 next year) - things (and expectations) have moved on an awful lot since then.

[YarisHybrid2016]

@Beekeeper D Thanks for the post!

Is there any difference between P on the Auris/Prius, and P on the Yaris? I'm guessing perhaps not, but if memory serves, there is a "clunk" audible with P button on Auris, whereas non is audible on Yaris. It might be my imagination.

I still don't quite understand why Yaris didn't get the Prius-style mode selector (for those who are unaware, it has a conventional auto-style linear shifter, with P, R, N, D, B gates).

[/img]

[Anthony Poli]

@Beekeeper D Thanks for the post!

Is there any difference between P on the Auris/Prius, and P on the Yaris? I'm guessing perhaps not, but if memory serves, there is a "clunk" audible with P button on Auris, whereas non is audible on Yaris. It might be my imagination.

I still don't quite understand why Yaris didn't get the Prius-style mode selector (for those who are unaware, it has a conventional auto-style linear shifter, with P, R, N, D, B gates).

[/img]

I think the idea was the joystick type selector was kept for the Prius and Auris, being more expensive and to tempt business users.

Can't say I can't hear any difference between our Yaris and Auris when selecting P.

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[Sooty]

There is another misinterpretation through this thread - the repeated use of the phrase "high intensity brakelights". 

There's no such thing. (Apart from some Volvo idea for 'emergency stop' automated warning...)

Brakelight brightness is regulated by the Construction and Use Regulations. It is limited by law to what is tolerable to closely-following (queuing) traffic. 

Perhaps the confusion is caused by the term "high level brakelights" - which means "high-mounted for better visibility", not brighter. 

The only "high intensity" rear lights are rear foglights (only for use in poor visibility conditions - fog, heavy spray or falling snow), which should never be used in stop-start traffic, and the abuse of which is something I personally do find thoughtless, annoying, fatiguing, distracting and thus unsafe.

 

Beekeeper,

If my memory serves me correctly, both brake lights and rear fog lights are 21W bulbs if they are of the conventional type. The tail lights are 5W. This would make both brake and fog lights "High Intensity"

[Anthony Poli]

51 minutes ago, Sooty said:

There is another misinterpretation through this thread - the repeated use of the phrase "high intensity brakelights". 

There's no such thing. (Apart from some Volvo idea for 'emergency stop' automated warning...)

Brakelight brightness is regulated by the Construction and Use Regulations. It is limited by law to what is tolerable to closely-following (queuing) traffic. 

Perhaps the confusion is caused by the term "high level brakelights" - which means "high-mounted for better visibility", not brighter. 

The only "high intensity" rear lights are rear foglights (only for use in poor visibility conditions - fog, heavy spray or falling snow), which should never be used in stop-start traffic, and the abuse of which is something I personally do find thoughtless, annoying, fatiguing, distracting and thus unsafe.

 

Beekeeper,

If my memory serves me correctly, both brake lights and rear fog lights are 21W bulbs if they are of the conventional type. The tail lights are 5W. This would make both brake and fog lights "High Intensity"

In the manual for my Auris, the Brake light bulb is is only 16W compared to the rear fog which is 21W. On the previous car a Corolla verso, both were 21W.

[TomdeGuerre]

24 minutes ago, Anthony Poli said:

n the manual for my Auris, the Brake light bulb is is only 16W compared to the rear fog which is 21W. On the previous car a Corolla verso, both were 21W.

On my Auris the Stop/Tail light bulbs are 21 / 5 watts, I expect they'll be the usual offset pin type. So does the hybrid have LED brake lights? 

[Anthony Poli]

2 minutes ago, TomdeGuerre said:

On my Auris the Stop/Tail light bulbs are 21 / 5 watts, I expect they'll be the usual offset pin type. So does the hybrid have LED brake lights? 

I have a 2010 Hybrid, the only LED brake light is the high mounted one,

[TomdeGuerre]

Just realised I mis-read your post, thought you said 6 watt. 16 watt LED would be a trifle bright.

[Anthony Poli]

20 minutes ago, TomdeGuerre said:

Just realised I mis-read your post, thought you said 6 watt. 16 watt LED would be a trifle bright.

The Yaris hybrid we have, only has LED, so that could be expensive in time.

[PeteB]

42 minutes ago, TomdeGuerre said:

On my Auris the Stop/Tail light bulbs are 21 / 5 watts, I expect they'll be the usual offset pin type. So does the hybrid have LED brake lights? 

Prius have had LED brake lights since the Gen 2 (2004) - not sure about other Toyota Hybrids

[Anthony Poli]

Just now, PeteB said:

Prius have had LED brake lights since the Gen 2 (2004) - not sure about other Toyota Hybrids

The Prius has got a few benefits that filter down to the rest of us in time

Maybe next time I'll find one in my budget, or anything with a bigger boot on my 1st gen Auris.

[kithmo]

18 hours ago, Anthony Poli said:

I think the idea was the joystick type selector was kept for the Prius and Auris, being more expensive and to tempt business users.

Can't say I can't hear any difference between our Yaris and Auris when selecting P.

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Is there a button to press on the gear knob to move the selector out of "P" or does it just move freely (with foot on brake) down the slots. 

[Anthony Poli]

Just now, kithmo said:

Is there a button to press on the gear knob to move the selector out of "P" or does it just move freely (with foot on brake) down the slots. 

I take it, you are talking about the Yaris.

No button, just need your foot on the brake.

[CPN]

19 hours ago, Anthony Poli said:

I think the idea was the joystick type selector was kept for the Prius and Auris, being more expensive and to tempt business users.

Can't say I can't hear any difference between our Yaris and Auris when selecting P.

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...and perhaps another point to bear in mind is that they are ALL just electronic switches underneath. It's only the Yaris one that has been made to "look like" a conventional auto lever (when it really isn't). Actually, contrary to what you think Anthony, I suspect that the Prius/Auris "joystick" units probably cost less to make not more...

[Anthony Poli]

I think the idea was the joystick type selector was kept for the Prius and Auris, being more expensive and to tempt business users.

Can't say I can't hear any difference between our Yaris and Auris when selecting P.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

...and perhaps another point to bear in mind is that they are ALL just electronic switches underneath. It's only the Yaris one that has been made to "look like" a conventional auto lever (when it really isn't). Actually, contrary to what you think Anthony, I suspect that the Prius/Auris "joystick" units probably cost less to make not more...

Sorry I didn't mean the Yaris selector was cheaper, just didn't look as high tech compared to the look of the Prius joystick.

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[YarisHybrid2016]

I wondered if there was an element of "premium"/exclusiveness of the shifter design, as it is distinctive.

My Yaris, at least, has LEDs for tail lights and all brake lights, as well as LED DRLs. All other lights are conventional bulbs.

I have seen other Yaris hybrids with conventional DRLs, and even conventional tail lights, so not sure if there is a spec difference within the same model year or not.

The brake lights on mine (all) seem to be brighter than the tail lights, but I'm not sure if they're also more directional (they appear to be), which would have the effect of increasing brightness for a given power.

[CPN]

29 minutes ago, Anthony Poli said:

Sorry I didn't mean the Yaris selector was cheaper, just didn't look as high tech compared to the look of the Prius joystick.

That much is true! 

[Anthony Poli]

Sorry I didn't mean the Yaris selector was cheaper, just didn't look as high tech compared to the look of the Prius joystick.

That much is true! 

My problem with the Yaris is I forget it doesn't go into park when you turn the car off. I can imagine I would have fun getting used to the Prius foot operated parking brake.

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