Broker Or Dealer ?

[paulmel]

Hi there,first post........Here goes !

I've been debating which model to go for now for nearly 4 months, XTR or T180. Two reasons for the delay are,1,still trying to sell my Peogeot 307,2, the run flat issues with the T180 have given me many sleepless nights. Basically, it had to be a model without the rear mounted wheel (personal preference)

Our second car is the 2.0 petrol '95 Auto model which initially put us onto the Toyota brand.

Anyway, my problem has been solved with the introduction of the new spec. of choice of rear doors on all models. So it's going to be the XT5 (although the Peugeot still hasn't sold)

Surfing the internet has found a new,U K car for £3500 cheaper than a main dealer. It's from a car broker and seems all above board.

We have the money ready to buy the Rav as soon as we sell the Peugeot.

My only concern is what sort of reception I'll receive from my local Toyota dealer when it comes to servicing etc as thats where I'll be taking it. Will they know I "cut out the middle man" ? Will my treatment as a customer differ in any way ? And, fingers crossed, if anything were to go wrong, will I get fobbed of in any way as it wasn't dealer supplied ?

[bothwell_buyer]

Hi there,first post........Here goes !

I've been debating which model to go for now for nearly 4 months, XTR or T180. Two reasons for the delay are,1,still trying to sell my Peogeot 307,2, the run flat issues with the T180 have given me many sleepless nights. Basically, it had to be a model without the rear mounted wheel (personal preference)

Our second car is the 2.0 petrol '95 Auto model which initially put us onto the Toyota brand.

Anyway, my problem has been solved with the introduction of the new spec. of choice of rear doors on all models. So it's going to be the XT5 (although the Peugeot still hasn't sold)

Surfing the internet has found a new,U K car for £3500 cheaper than a main dealer. It's from a car broker and seems all above board.

We have the money ready to buy the Rav as soon as we sell the Peugeot.

My only concern is what sort of reception I'll receive from my local Toyota dealer when it comes to servicing etc as thats where I'll be taking it. Will they know I "cut out the middle man" ? Will my treatment as a customer differ in any way ? And, fingers crossed, if anything were to go wrong, will I get fobbed of in any way as it wasn't dealer supplied ?

It should not make any difference. Apart from dealerships changing all the time, a dealer does not need the hassle of you, a customer, greeting about poor service from a particular dealer. Otherwise they will lose the franchise when the time comes.

Simply, you have a contract, once bought, with Toyota to provide a new car. You can choose where you want it serviced, and the warranty will intact as long as you abide by the conditions of such - which are usually getting it serviced at a Toyota dealer at the given time/mileage. I doubt if the warranty will ever name a dealer or garage, cos dealers change.

And you will pay the same as anyone else getting a service done so should get treated the same...better if they want to keep your business.

have fun,

ian

[bjw]

This is a copy of a posting which I made on another thread I suggest you do a search on brokers as this comes up quite often

Quote

I have posted on this subject before on the forum and I will tell you how I did my deal.

I Used Carfile ( ask for Jonathan)I cannot praise them enough it was a simple call to them and they contacted a Toyota dealer who phoned me back within 10 minutes and the deal was agreed on the telephone and they even took my part exchange in and gave me the part exchange price I had been offered by local Toyota dealers ,

No money was paid until I collected the car and any promotions Toyota were offering was available to me

.

Fortunately I lived within 50 miles of the dealer that they used but I am sure if you spoke to them they may have a dealer in your area.

The strange thing is the dealer were I purchased the car from I had tried to do a deal with previously but would not match the deal I wanted.( because the broker deals with the dealers fleet department they matched the price I wanted)

Regarding the after sales service I think it does not matter where you purchase your car from at the end of the day a dealer can make money on servicing your car and should want to look after you .

Will dealers match online prices well the formula I have always used in the past is I find the broker price for the car and then find the trade value for the car I then go to a dealership with the cost to change and ask if they will match it if they do I buy but don't forget the trade in price is the price they would sell it to another dealer

You cannot expect top trade in price and a big discount off the new car but I am sure you know that

[Parts-King]

It makes no difference at all if you buy your car North or South, people move, have cars serviced when working in an area etc etc so dont be put off by not buying off a particular dealer. The way these car brokers work, like bjw says, is they are dealing with the dealers fleet department, fleet is not retail and you would never get that sort of discount in the showroom, the margin just isnt there. The extra discount is given directly from Toyota to the fleet company, the dealer just invoices it out. One point I would make is to ensure you are purchasing a UK registered car and not a parallel import, nothing wrong with them per say, but you have to get them registered with Toyota GB before you can start using the warranty system.

Kingo

[jock1]

It makes no difference at all if you buy your car North or South, people move, have cars serviced when working in an area etc etc so dont be put off by not buying off a particular dealer. The way these car brokers work, like bjw says, is they are dealing with the dealers fleet department, fleet is not retail and you would never get that sort of discount in the showroom, the margin just isnt there. The extra discount is given directly from Toyota to the fleet company, the dealer just invoices it out. One point I would make is to ensure you are purchasing a UK registered car and not a parallel import, nothing wrong with them per say, but you have to get them registered with Toyota GB before you can start using the warranty system.

Kingo

Paulmel. I can vouch for what Kingo gas said.i bought my XT-R through a broker 12 month ago and his dealership welcomed me with open arms when my car had it's first service recently. Have sent you a personal message.

[gray22]

Wonder if the prices they are quoting on carfile are what you actually pay, i did some research a while back into using this route rather than a dealership, to be warned, that if you finance the car with a broker, you may well pay more in the end, as the repayments are generally higher than elsewhere, maybe this is why they seem cheaper, i am not 100% sure about this.

If it is a good deal, and the savings are genuine, wouldnt a lot more people be taking this route, just a thought .

[bjw]

Wonder if the prices they are quoting on carfile are what you actually pay, i did some research a while back into using this route rather than a dealership, to be warned, that if you finance the car with a broker, you may well pay more in the end, as the repayments are generally higher than elsewhere, maybe this is why they seem cheaper, i am not 100% sure about this.

If it is a good deal, and the savings are genuine, wouldnt a lot more people be taking this route, just a thought .

The only contact with Carfile was the first call after that the Toyota dealer handled everything else from then on !! if finance had been required it would have been done through Toyota finance.

When you trade a non Toyota car in the dealer does not sell it on his forecourt unless it is a model which is in demand he will usually sell it on in the trade

[gray22]

Wonder if the prices they are quoting on carfile are what you actually pay, i did some research a while back into using this route rather than a dealership, to be warned, that if you finance the car with a broker, you may well pay more in the end, as the repayments are generally higher than elsewhere, maybe this is why they seem cheaper, i am not 100% sure about this.

If it is a good deal, and the savings are genuine, wouldnt a lot more people be taking this route, just a thought .

The only contact with Carfile was the first call after that the Toyota dealer handled everything else from then on !! if finance had been required it would have been done through Toyota finance.

When you trade a non Toyota car in the dealer does not sell it on his forecourt unless it is a model which is in demand he will usually sell it on in the trade

sounds good then , might look into it.

[paulmel]

Wonder if the prices they are quoting on carfile are what you actually pay, i did some research a while back into using this route rather than a dealership, to be warned, that if you finance the car with a broker, you may well pay more in the end, as the repayments are generally higher than elsewhere, maybe this is why they seem cheaper, i am not 100% sure about this.

If it is a good deal, and the savings are genuine, wouldnt a lot more people be taking this route, just a thought .

The only contact with Carfile was the first call after that the Toyota dealer handled everything else from then on !! if finance had been required it would have been done through Toyota finance.

When you trade a non Toyota car in the dealer does not sell it on his forecourt unless it is a model which is in demand he will usually sell it on in the trade

sounds good then , might look into it.

Thanks to all for your replies.

Coincidently, I've just had a past Toyota dealer phone me up who tried to do a deal late last year ,who, when informed of my current situation, has taken it upon himself to try to match the brokers price and take my Peugeot off me. Promised to be back in touch when he had "spoken to the manager" Will let you all know the outcome.

[Parts-King]

Give me the spec you want Paulmel, I can get our guys on the case as well, it's what we do!

Any car, any spec, PX as well

PM me for further details

Kingo

[bjw]

Give me the spec you want Paulmel, I can get our guys on the case as well, it's what we do!

Any car, any spec, PX as well

PM me for further details

Kingo

You never know Kingo may be able to sort out a good deal for you !!

[jock1]

Give me the spec you want Paulmel, I can get our guys on the case as well, it's what we do!

Any car, any spec, PX as well

PM me for further details

Kingo

You never know Kingo may be able to sort out a good deal for you !!

If you have the money available without requiring finanace these brokers (I can only speak for Drive The Deal) are excellent. If you require finanace and part ex the brokers become slihgtly less attractive and maybe Kingo's lot come into their own. If it is a cash purchase the savings are considerable with a broker ,including discounts on the extras ie Style/protection packs roof rails etc.

[jock1]

Paulmel.Check your personal messages.

[Pretani]

Hi Paul,

Not had chance to read all the responses so sorry if I'm repeating things already said.

I would use a dealer for the following reasons:

1) You can rely on the dealer giving you good service if you have bought the car from there rather than from a broker.

2) If you're going for the XT-R you have a month to buy it on interest free credit - therefore your money can sit in the bank earning interest. You can pay it off early without any charges.

3) Work out what your Peugeot is worth and add a bit and they should do you a deal. Depends on how hard you haggle for a discount off the price. Reckon the interest free saves £1,500 of interest added to the money you would save by keeping your cash in the bank.

Sounds like you're in a good position. As for the run flat tyres - I've had them on a BMW about four years ago, yes they're a little more expensive to replace but other than that fine. I think the run flat tyres are made differently than the normal and are harder to puncture?

[jock1]

Hi Paul,

Not had chance to read all the responses so sorry if I'm repeating things already said.

I would use a dealer for the following reasons:

1) You can rely on the dealer giving you good service if you have bought the car from there rather than from a broker.

2) If you're going for the XT-R you have a month to buy it on interest free credit - therefore your money can sit in the bank earning interest. You can pay it off early without any charges.

3) Work out what your Peugeot is worth and add a bit and they should do you a deal. Depends on how hard you haggle for a discount off the price. Reckon the interest free saves £1,500 of interest added to the money you would save by keeping your cash in the bank.

Sounds like you're in a good position. As for the run flat tyres - I've had them on a BMW about four years ago, yes they're a little more expensive to replace but other than that fine. I think the run flat tyres are made differently than the normal and are harder to puncture?

If you had read Parts Kings reply earlier you would have read that a dealership will take on maintenance and warranty work happily even if they did not supply the car. I repeat , if the finance is available up to 3500 pounds saving for the model you want at the spec you require is not to be sniffed.Under these circumstances there is no contest.The reputable brokers are getting the cars from main agents anyway.

[D Winter]

My brother in law reckons that when he worked for a large car dealership (Franchised and a well known make) that they always looked after customers more who bought their cars at the dealer and also had it serviced there. He runs his own car dealership now and I have no reason to expect that's its changed.

[Parts-King]

It's true to say we look after people who buy cars off us, why would'nt we?, they are our lifeblood, repeat business is very much appreciated. that's not to say we would'nt look after somebody who buys there car elsewhere, of course we would, but repeat customers get that little bit extra at part exchange time :D:

We always do our best to get your business, it is a buyers market and we know it. There are those who will be happy with an internet deal via a broker, however most of our customers enjoy the experience of browsing the showroom and sitting in different models, and chatting to people who are knowledgable about the product, it is a total buying experience, not just a cash purchase over the internet. I could go on about brokers and what they do to get the business, but that is probably best left for a face to face discussion rather than via a forum.

Kingo

[bjw]

Give me the spec you want Paulmel, I can get our guys on the case as well, it's what we do!

Any car, any spec, PX as well

PM me for further details

Kingo

You never know Kingo may be able to sort out a good deal for you !!

If you have the money available without requiring finance these brokers (I can only speak for Drive The Deal) are excellent. If you require finance and part ex the brokers become slightly less attractive and maybe Kingo's lot come into their own. If it is a cash purchase the savings are considerable with a broker ,including discounts on the extras ie Style/protection packs roof rails etc.

As I said in my previous post the only dealing with the car broker was the initial call to them after that my dealings were completely with the Toyota dealer I did not speak to the broker again .

Any finance if required will be handled by the Toyota dealer exactly the same way as if you had just walked in his showroom.

I not saying that all brokers operate this way but it certainly was the case with carfile .

With regards part exchange how many of you have gone to do a deal and the salesman has not even looked at your car but looked at the glasses guide and then given you a price on it !! or if it was not of the same franchise has phoned to get the trade in quote underwritten by another trader (On my deal the trade in price for my car was agreed over the telephone but the car was under 3 years old

[bjw]

It's true to say we look after people who buy cars off us, why would'nt we?, they are our lifeblood, repeat business is very much appreciated. that's not to say we would'nt look after somebody who buys there car elsewhere, of course we would, but repeat customers get that little bit extra at part exchange time :D:

We always do our best to get your business, it is a buyers market and we know it. There are those who will be happy with an internet deal via a broker, however most of our customers enjoy the experience of browsing the showroom and sitting in different models, and chatting to people who are knowledgable about the product, it is a total buying experience, not just a cash purchase over the internet. I could go on about brokers and what they do to get the business, but that is probably best left for a face to face discussion rather than via a forum.

Kingo

I am sure you will agree the servicing and parts sales are just or even more important than the sales side to the profitability of the business

Working on your theory above Kingo the dealership that I had used for 20 years which could not match the deal I wanted . So I went to a car broker (Carfile) and they obtained the deal I wanted with same dealership that could not match the figures a week before ????

As an example who do you give the best service to

1 A customer who has never bought a new car from your dealership but always has his car serviced by your dealership.

2 A customer who buys a new car from you but gets his car serviced elsewhere

The answer is you treat them both the same because any dealer will always be looking to build a relationship with his customers because thats what sales is all about ( and to honest that is what you said above in a roundabout way)

[bothwell_buyer]

I bought 2 new Toyotas from the then local T dealership. They took me for a mug and charged excessive fees for servicing; and eventually overcharged me so much that I haven't been near them ever again - even to buy petrol.

I do the same with any garage that mucks about - I tell lots of other people locally, and I avoid the garage like the plague. As Kingo has said, its a buyers market and there are still many garages around to choose from.

With the advent of the internet and forums, it is even easier to spread the word of good and bad garages. Most decent garages or mechanics survive on word of mouth as the cost of advertising goes up and up.....albeit there are still some clowns on eBay mucking about - but thats a gamble anyway!

[Yossarian]

Surfing the internet has found a new,U K car for £3500 cheaper than a main dealer. It's from a car broker and seems all above board.

I shopped around - brokers and local Toyota dealers - and in the end I bought locally. Not only did they match the best price via a broker but gave me a much better part exchange. If your main dealer wants £3500 more than a broker I suggest you look elsewhere - and negotiate! They obviously don't want your business.

Also, none of the dealers I was put in contact with via brokers were very near and I just find it more convenient to have an ongoing relationship with a local supplier. I hope I'm right - I collect the car later today!

[bjw]

Surfing the internet has found a new,U K car for £3500 cheaper than a main dealer. It's from a car broker and seems all above board.

I shopped around - brokers and local Toyota dealers - and in the end I bought locally. Not only did they match the best price via a broker but gave me a much better part exchange. If your main dealer wants £3500 more than a broker I suggest you look elsewhere - and negotiate! They obviously don't want your business.

Also, none of the dealers I was put in contact with via brokers were very near and I just find it more convenient to have an ongoing relationship with a local supplier. I hope I'm right - I collect the car later today!

I have also used local dealers and they have matched broker prices but it sometimes like getting blood out of a stone but they will do it if they know you are a serious buyer and if they do not match it you will go elsewhere !!!

To be honest if you can get a deal with a local dealer so much the better

[paulmel]

Hi there,first post........Here goes !

I've been debating which model to go for now for nearly 4 months, XTR or T180. Two reasons for the delay are,1,still trying to sell my Peogeot 307,2, the run flat issues with the T180 have given me many sleepless nights. Basically, it had to be a model without the rear mounted wheel (personal preference)

Our second car is the 2.0 petrol '95 Auto model which initially put us onto the Toyota brand.

Anyway, my problem has been solved with the introduction of the new spec. of choice of rear doors on all models. So it's going to be the XT5 (although the Peugeot still hasn't sold)

Surfing the internet has found a new,U K car for £3500 cheaper than a main dealer. It's from a car broker and seems all above board.

We have the money ready to buy the Rav as soon as we sell the Peugeot.

My only concern is what sort of reception I'll receive from my local Toyota dealer when it comes to servicing etc as thats where I'll be taking it. Will they know I "cut out the middle man" ? Will my treatment as a customer differ in any way ? And, fingers crossed, if anything were to go wrong, will I get fobbed of in any way as it wasn't dealer supplied ?