Engine Number 3 ?

[CharlieFarlie]

One thing for sure charlie is 7 new sensors will not cure that problem in my book, If the sensors didnt pick it up the first time they wont the second. That only tells me its one of two things. Anchorman said thats the second engine with the same symptoms? is this true, the simplist explanation would be pcv valve blocked causing pressure in sump, not doing any mechanical harm normally but would force oil out through sump seals etc over time, or which ever seal was weakest. Pcv valve would do all this and possibly not trigger any sensors. The second as i mentioned earlier was rings but this is hard to believe in a brand new engine with so little miles. I dont really go with the overheating one, doesnt sound logical in my book with so many sensors nowadays linked to the cooling system and no codes stored. I guess i should have asked you first charlie was there any pressure behind the oil cap when you took it off before i started rambling about pcv valves lol

So if a sensor that is faulty and then changed it will not register a fault ??? MMmmmm Strange .............

In my experience charlie a faulty sensor would have registered ghost faults before now rather than not anything at all at the time of the problem (although at times i have been proved wrong). Look dont get me wrong m8 im not picking holes in your dealer, by all accounts he has done everthing i could think of and more to rectify any possible future problems and they are far more familiar with your vehicle than i will ever be. Im just pointing out that changing these sensors is a precautionary move as i suspect (maybe wrongly) the dealer didnt find any of the sensors faulty. I really hope it was a blip on the radar and the vehicle will run sweetly from now on. God knows after 2 engines you need a bit of motoring bliss

Perhaps I am misunderstanding ?

No faults were recorded on a system that will definitely record a fault unless that sensor that should have picked it up is or was faulty..

So replacing sensors will eliminate the fault being recorded IF the problem should re occur ?? At least that is My understanding...

Let Me be clear here. I am desperately unhappy both with the car and the current situation and the explanation while I believe it is the best under the circumstances the Dealer can come up with is .... Well C R A P !!!

[CharlieFarlie]

One thing for sure charlie is 7 new sensors will not cure that problem in my book, If the sensors didnt pick it up the first time they wont the second. That only tells me its one of two things. Anchorman said thats the second engine with the same symptoms? is this true, the simplist explanation would be pcv valve blocked causing pressure in sump, not doing any mechanical harm normally but would force oil out through sump seals etc over time, or which ever seal was weakest. Pcv valve would do all this and possibly not trigger any sensors. The second as i mentioned earlier was rings but this is hard to believe in a brand new engine with so little miles. I dont really go with the overheating one, doesnt sound logical in my book with so many sensors nowadays linked to the cooling system and no codes stored. I guess i should have asked you first charlie was there any pressure behind the oil cap when you took it off before i started rambling about pcv valves lol

So if a sensor that is faulty and then changed it will not register a fault ??? MMmmmm Strange .............

In my experience charlie a faulty sensor would have registered ghost faults before now rather than not anything at all at the time of the problem (although at times i have been proved wrong). Look dont get me wrong m8 im not picking holes in your dealer, by all accounts he has done everthing i could think of and more to rectify any possible future problems and they are far more familiar with your vehicle than i will ever be. Im just pointing out that changing these sensors is a precautionary move as i suspect (maybe wrongly) the dealer didnt find any of the sensors faulty. I really hope it was a blip on the radar and the vehicle will run sweetly from now on. God knows after 2 engines you need a bit of motoring bliss

Perhaps I am misunderstanding ?

No faults were recorded on a system that will definitely record a fault unless that sensor that should have picked it up is or was faulty..

So replacing sensors will eliminate the fault being recorded IF the problem should re occur ?? At least that is My understanding...

Let Me be clear here. I am desperately unhappy both with the car and the current situation and the explanation while I believe it is the best under the circumstances the Dealer can come up with is .... Well C R A P !!!

Blitzing 7 sensors for an unknown reason sounds, like they hav'nt got a clue what happened, and and just changing bulk parts and hoping for the best.........

Praying it don't come back :D

I doubt your dealership will go back to Toyota GB after fitting 2 new engines, as TGB will just laugh at them

Hope it all works out for you though Charlie

Jedi.. Do You ever take a balanced reasonable view ?? Or can Your mind only work in silly rather silly cynical way .. You condemn everything out of hand and anyone's views or comments are always scorned upon.. Its getting boring Chap..........

[jedi134]

Sorry dude, that's just the way it is

[CharlieFarlie]

Sorry dude, that's just the way it is

Aye it is .. Perhaps that is why You come over as a bit of a pillock ??

Dont understand Ya Mate.. You are obviously an intelligent Guy with a lot to contribute yet always its the ***** take or negativity ?

I realise I take a rather negative stance on the engines but that is with at least reasonable reason.. Whats Yours ??

[Grenadekidffere]

Firstly I am not looking for confrontation or being insensitive to someones plight unlike some charlie, Yes i agree with you that the replacement of the sensors will rule them out if the problem reappears. Nobody including the dealer knows what the fault is or has been and if he told you that your engine will definately record every fault that happens to it, he is quite frankly living in cuckoo land. Sorry to be blunt but i do know the crap they talk in among the truths as you are somewhat aware. not all parts of the engine are covered by sensors (thankfully) the reason i say this is because theres already too many when it comes to trying to absorb a single or multiple codes which could mean any one of a dozen costly parts on a car could be faulty if you are not very familiar with that vehicle. I grew up in a mechanical world not a computerized one

regards kev

[jedi134]

Sorry dude, that's just the way it is

Aye it is .. Perhaps that is why You come over as a bit of a pillock ??

Dont understand Ya Mate.. You are obviously an intelligent Guy with a lot to contribute yet always its the ***** take or negativity ?

I realise I take a rather negative stance on the engines but that is with at least reasonable reason.. Whats Yours ??

It was a dig at the dealership, no offense to you Charlie mate :D

I'm sure it will all get sorted.......one day :P

That is my balanced view, the dealership is crap

[junebug1701]

Charlie, I just read about your plight and can't believe the rotten luck you've had with this vehicle. I would write a polite letter to Toyota and maybe the right person will read it and do something.

So the dealer said the thermostat stuck and caused the engine to overheat? Did you notice the temperature gauge on the dash when you pulled over? Was it in the normal range or more towards the H? What about the water pump--did the dealer check that? I've never owned a diesel, but I did have 2 Fords that had the same water pump problem. The pump would work well enough in town and short hops, but on extended trips the impeller would slip and not pump very much coolant, causing the engine to overheat. If your water pump failed it would be just as you described--no codes, no warning lights other than the needle on the temperature gauge.

I hope you get this sorted out quickly. And I'm with you--if it happened again, I would just keep driving until it burns up!

[anchorman]

I would urge caution on the engine wrecking thing. Firstly I doubt you could run an engine knowing you were about to wreck it or you would have done it last time - I don't think it is in your nature. Secondly, you have to be confident you won't end up with a bill. Is that chip still fitted? You don't know what is causing this lot so take care.

[Davrav]

Is that chip still fitted? You don't know what is causing this lot so take care.

I was wondering about the chip - it was designed/set up for the original T180 engine incarnation.

The replacement engines have, presumably, been the modified versions. Would anything in these modified engines affect the operation of the chip or vice versa

[CharlieFarlie]

Charlie, I just read about your plight and can't believe the rotten luck you've had with this vehicle. I would write a polite letter to Toyota and maybe the right person will read it and do something.

So the dealer said the thermostat stuck and caused the engine to overheat? Did you notice the temperature gauge on the dash when you pulled over? Was it in the normal range or more towards the H? What about the water pump--did the dealer check that? I've never owned a diesel, but I did have 2 Fords that had the same water pump problem. The pump would work well enough in town and short hops, but on extended trips the impeller would slip and not pump very much coolant, causing the engine to overheat. If your water pump failed it would be just as you described--no codes, no warning lights other than the needle on the temperature gauge.

I hope you get this sorted out quickly. And I'm with you--if it happened again, I would just keep driving until it burns up!

Mate Toyota have done something. They have hopefully sorted the car and given it an interim service as well.. The water pump was changed at 45K miles along with engine number 2.. I think that the replacing of the thermostat was a clutching at straws effort done by the Dealer to indicate that they are trying hard.. Not for a second do I think the stat needed changing or the coolant and oil for that matter or even the sensors but what else can I realistically ask for ??

I did not for some reason look at the temperature gauge !! For the life of Me I cannot think why but that's the way it happened..

The Dealer assures Me that in the event of an overheat that would threaten the engine the car would go first into limp mode having displayed lights on the dash and would shut down if this was ignored...

I have to say that the Dealer has been exceptional and I could not ask for better service efforts and communication.. Blimey even the loan car was delivered Full of fuel and a note in the car telling Me not to re fuel it !!

I am unconvinced that anything that was done is related to the problem and I voiced this in polite but no uncertain terms to the Service Manager...

Realistically all I can do is drive the car and see what happens.. I have done 140 miles today and it seems just fine...

Jedi. Not only are You ridiculous comments boring but they are also very wide of the mark... I am beginning to sound like advertiser for said Dealer but they have been absolutely outstanding and could do no more plain and simple.. Believe Me if they had not I would have gotten very unpleasant indeed.... But there was no need thankfully ..........

I

[CharlieFarlie]

Don. My comments were made in frustration and a little tongue in cheek.. Yes I would be tempted to blow the whole flaming car up but to knowingly destroy the engine would leave Me wide open and is something I could and would not do anyway...

The chip is not fitted and is in My tool chest 360 miles north of here... In fact if anyone wants to buy it shout up as its for sale...

[CharlieFarlie]

Is that chip still fitted? You don't know what is causing this lot so take care.

I was wondering about the chip - it was designed/set up for the original T180 engine incarnation.

The replacement engines have, presumably, been the modified versions. Would anything in these modified engines affect the operation of the chip or vice versa

Its not on the car David so We can rule that out ...

The engines 2AD are all the same .. Its the injectors an engine management along with a different engine map that gives the T180 its extra power. Plus likely a few other parts like maybe a slightly different exhaust ect ect..

So the Lindop chip will only work with the T180s set up and wont work with say the 150 BHP variant...

[blue monster]

Charlie, I have just read all of this and what can I say - absolutely gutted for you mate that you have had all this trouble and that you and your good lady were inconvenienced.

As for the chip kit - we carried our kingo kit over from the old engine and have it on the new engine which is just shy of 10k now with absolutely no issues what so ever. So I think it would be fairly safe to say that it's not the chip kit causing your problems.

You really have had your fair share of bad luck with this mate and I really hope you get it sorted one way or the other

Best of luck!!

Martin

[varonda]

Not wanting to appear a bit dim but from what I've read, about the only thing not changed on

your motor is the ECU, could this be a problem or have I got the nasty smelly end of the stick?

[CharlieFarlie]

Not wanting to appear a bit dim but from what I've read, about the only thing not changed on

your motor is the ECU, could this be a problem or have I got the nasty smelly end of the stick?

Really dont know if the ECU could do or cause these problems ?? Or a Lindop chip for that matter... I was going to re fit the Lindop box and did for a short while after a conversation with Anchorman where We agreed that it could do no harm... But I took it back off again as I had a local chap to where I live coming to look at the car the day before I travelled south for three weeks..

As the Lindop kit was not part of the deal I took it off.......

Chap had a shift change and wanted to view the car a day late but I could hang on no longer so We agreed He would look at the car when I get back home.. This arrangement still stands...

[rambler]

Hi Charlie

Well after reading all this.......blimey ! !

I still have engine hesitation issue's even with using additives ,but at least mine's still going.And no faults being registered.

I really feel for you,this must be quite a worry.

Come on toyota......sort this out....we are all reading this thread,which can't be good for potential toyota Rav4 customers.

C O M E O N TOYOTA ! ! ! ! ,give this man a break.

[jedi134]

Yeah! come on Toyota get some proper engineers on this Job,,,,,,, 3rd engine now.......give this guy a break!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

STOP blowing smoke up his bottom....................:P

[local hero]

Charlie, I have just read all of this and what can I say - absolutely gutted for you mate that you have had all this trouble and that you and your good lady were inconvenienced.

As for the chip kit - we carried our kingo kit over from the old engine and have it on the new engine which is just shy of 10k now with absolutely no issues what so ever. So I think it would be fairly safe to say that it's not the chip kit causing your problems.

You really have had your fair share of bad luck with this mate and I really hope you get it sorted one way or the other

Best of luck!!

Martin

Mines not a 180, but chip has now been on nearly 5 yrs and transferred to new engine and never a single issue Stew

[anchorman]

I don't know what some of you want other than blood. You have to remember that they are not legally obliged to do anything let alone keep throwing engines at this car. We are in a very fortunate position where they are helping numerous owners that are invariably satisfied. The are not persecuting Charlie or neglecting him, they have spent a small fortune trying to put it right.

Charlie.

It is important that both the timing and the fuel mixture are correct in an engine to avoid overheating - that is why I asked about the chip. I can see no problem in running with the chip but if it malfunctioned it could have knock on effects. So could the ECU. If the dealer did miss something (dropped a clanger) the chances are we may never know what happened the other day. Ok it will be nice if it settles down but it is a bit unnerving not knowing exactly what happened.

[CharlieFarlie]

Don I totally agree with what You are saying.. But the chip was only re fitted to the car for about a week and 200 miles so could simply have no bearing on what has happened...

I have put up a post to sell the chip on Forum NOT because there is anything wrong with it ( I think Kingo will transfer the warranty anyway and if a Buyer is not happy I WILL refund !) But because the car will be going soon.

I have done near to 500 miles this week since getting the car back an it has been faultless.. What a shame this cat cant be like this all the time !!

Let Me state this one last time !!!

The Dealer has been BRILLIANT !! Yes its a mystery and all their efforts may have been in the wrong direction BUT what more could they possibly have done or do ??...

As some of You know I have had literally dozens of high end German cars and many Top end Fords. I currently have the Jag sat on the drive..

Would any of these Dealers done more ? Or even half what Toyota have done especially to a car over 5 1/2 Years old now ?? I doubt it NO. I know they would not have done .

Don. Yes You are right its nerving but I do have very good recovery with a hire car thrown in if needed and the assurance of the Service Manager that IF this should happen again it will get sorted....

At the moment the car is not that high on the list of priorities. When things calm down a wee but I can get the thing sold and away....

I am not happy to be selling it with a cloud hanging over it and certainly will not be selling it until I am happy its just tickety boo...

I just hope any new owner doesn't join this Forum ...

[t-spiritpete]

I don't know what some of you want other than blood. You have to remember that they are not legally obliged to do anything let alone keep throwing engines at this car. We are in a very fortunate position where they are helping numerous owners that are invariably satisfied. The are not persecuting Charlie or neglecting him, they have spent a small fortune trying to put it right.

Charlie.

It is important that both the timing and the fuel mixture are correct in an engine to avoid overheating - that is why I asked about the chip. I can see no problem in running with the chip but if it malfunctioned it could have knock on effects. So could the ECU. If the dealer did miss something (dropped a clanger) the chances are we may never know what happened the other day. Ok it will be nice if it settles down but it is a bit unnerving not knowing exactly what happened.

Don, Charlie and Tim, I do find it a little strange that the 2 vehicles that have had more than one replacement engine on this forum both have or had a tuning chip fitted and yes I do realise that many engines without tuning aids have also failed.

This reply is not intended to cause any upset etc to anyone especially who Charlie has been through hell already and I hope my comment is accepted in the manner it is intended.

Regards .... Pete.

[bitman]

Not wanting to appear a bit dim but from what I've read, about the only thing not changed on

your motor is the ECU, could this be a problem or have I got the nasty smelly end of the stick?

i might be the ecu as it's not the first time toyota has a problem with an ecu, search for rav 4 automatic ecu

ecu's are controlling everything in cars these days... this might also why nothing was stored

[CharlieFarlie]

Not wanting to appear a bit dim but from what I've read, about the only thing not changed on

your motor is the ECU, could this be a problem or have I got the nasty smelly end of the stick?

i might be the ecu as it's not the first time toyota has a problem with an ecu, search for rav 4 automatic ecu

ecu's are controlling everything in cars these days... this might also why nothing was stored

I would hope that if the ECUs are the problem Toyota would have twigged by now ?? Expensive as ECUs are it would be cheaper to change these than constantly shipping engines back and forth from Japan and fitting them ??

Surely the complex diagnostics equipment that Toyota have would have picked up if My ECU was at fault ?? After all if it is or was they would be able to bill Me for that as that element is not covered by warranty on a car this age,

[anchorman]

Not for the engine problem Charlie, for the overheating problem that jeopardised your new engine. Tuning issues can definitely cause overheating. Whatever caused the problem, there is no way they will admit to you what it was IF it was something they dropped a clanger with. They will not tell you that something they neglegted to do has inconvenienced you yet again. One thing for sure, they have done something or it wouldn't be running right now.

[ianfish]

Not wanting to appear a bit dim but from what I've read, about the only thing not changed on your motor is the ECU, could this be a problem or have I got the nasty smelly end of the stick?

i might be the ecu as it's not the first time toyota has a problem with an ecu, search for rav 4 automatic ecu ecu's are controlling everything in cars these days... this might also why nothing was stored

i have been following this with interest having bought an 07 XT4 a few months ago (72K) i did notice that it has a sticker in the engine bay that states "ECU reprogramed 2008". At the moment I have no problems or issues, runs really well, brilliant vehicle for long journeys, fingers crossed!!