Proportioning Valve Crossed The Lines For Rear Wheels

[sammy20]

toyota corolla 1.4 2000 vvti GS

hi guys ,

i think the stupid Mechanic crossed the rear lines after rear brake lines replacement for the mot (rusted rear brake lines) and can't find any diagram for the proportioning valve but i have photo before he touched the car and its look that the the rear right it goes to the right outlet not the the left?!!!.

the first photo befor replacement

http://desmond.image...jpg&res=landing

the abs unit has two lines from the master cylinder and four lines to the wheels

1.the first one from the left to (front right) ok never touched

2.the second one from the left to the (rear left) wrong i think it should be connected to the rear right instead!?

3.the third one from the left to the (rear right) wrong i think it should be connected to the rear left instead!?

4.the fourth one from the left to the (front left). ok never touched

FR- RR - RL -FL NOT FR- RL - RR -FL

the second photo for ABS UNIT

http://desmond.image...jpg&res=landing

that is the proportioning valv after he install the new lines

the third photo after replacement

http://desmond.image...jpg&res=landing

i think the abs unit is the right guide for this mess .

i think IT SHOULD BE FROM THE LIFT OF THE ABS UNIT outlets FR- RR - RL -FL NOT FR- RL - RR -FL.

NOTE:

this mechanic damaged the brake system on my car after he replaced the rear lines i noticed spongy pedal no pressure whatsoever i went back to him he bled the brake with the engine running at that time i knew he he done something wrong and stupid. i have changed the master cylinder and new pads new front brake disks no joy its still !Removed! soft spongy sinks down to the floor .now the abs light is on i bought one from eBay and i will try to install it this week.

i noticed the brake fluid in the reservoir was orange near to red so i flushed it with carlube dot4 many many times and bled and bled with pressure bleeder no joy still spongy after wasted 6 liters of brake fluid . i think he put dodgy brake fluid it could be dot 5 or red diesel who knows lol,,,,, this dodgy fluid damaged the abs unit causing( internal leaks) .

please any idea?!!

sammy

[oldcodger]

Hi,

That all sounds really bad.

Cannot help with the orientation of the rear pipes.

The more worrying thing is the pressure drop on the pedal.

Is there any sign of fluid leaks from any front /back slave cylinder / piston or connections or serious bellowing of the rubber brake hoses by the wheels - you need someone to help you check that.

What was the 'new' master cylinder, a brand new one or from the scrappers, if so do you fit a new set of rubbers to it ?

[sammy20]

its

Hi,

That all sounds really bad.

Cannot help with the orientation of the rear pipes.

The more worrying thing is the pressure drop on the pedal.

Is there any sign of fluid leaks from any front /back slave cylinder / piston or connections or serious bellowing of the rubber brake hoses by the wheels - you need someone to help you check that.

What was the 'new' master cylinder, a brand new one or from the scrappers, if so do you fit a new set of rubbers to it ?

Thanks mate for the reply, there is no leaks in the system i checked all connection even under the car. i topped up the reservoir to the brim and drove the car for 2 weeks with no sign of leaks. secondhand master cylinder from scrappers and there is only one rubber at the back of the master cylinder facing the booster for vacuum pressure and it's okay.

i bled the second master cylinder on the car because its has bleeder at bottom .even i bench bleed the old one and i can stand on it with no pressure loose.

but i never bother to install the old. because i plugged the the two outlets on the second master cylinder and removed the abs fuse then turn the engine on the brake pedal was hard as a rock.

i done the same test to the rear outlets from the proportioning valve i plugged both removed the fuse then turn the engine on and the brake pedal sinks down to the floor.

so, it's not the master cylinder nor rear brakes causing this problem. i will try to fix it this week because i went to two mechanics and its seems they don't want to bother because they have no time to chase such problem.

again thanks for your help.

sammy

[oldcodger]

Hi,

From my limited exerience of doing brakes you have to be mega sure everythings 100% cos when it fails its one of the most sickening feelings when you are doing 30mph approaching a T junction ! ( in my younger days of car repairs! )

Testing and using a 12 year old rubber seal in a 12 year old cylinder bore would not give me the greatest confidence.

When you say the brake pedal sinks to the floor, do you mean you put your foot on it and it literally goes to the floor on that same stroke or if you are at a standstill with the engine running you place your foot hard on the pedal and over 5 -30 seconds the pedal slowly sinks down ?

When it sinks down, what happens if you quicky release the pedal and then immediately press down once again, ( pump) does the pressure return and hold or sink down again ?

If you are sure its not the master cylinder or ballooning of the rubber brake hoses, perhaps its a fault with the abs unit, but afaid I have no idea of if function or potential problems, perhaps someone else can help out there ..

[Steven252]

Are any of the rubber connection hoses bubbiling under the pressure?

[sammy20]

**********update on the proportioning valve outlets lines order*************

hi guys,

today i went to the scrappers because they have the same car i looked inside and i can see the right outlet goes to the rear right so i asked the guy to lift the car up with forklift so he did we looked underneath the car by following the brake lines connection and that was confirmed the (right outlet) on the proportioning valve to the rear right wheel and (left outlet) to rear left wheel.

so, there you go the stupid Mechanic crossed the rear brake lines and probably damaged the rear wheel speed sensors ....idiot idiot idiot i will have to check them.

FR- RR - RL -FL ok

FR- RL - RR -FL wrong

i hope this would help anyone trying to solve the same problem.

****more updates this week****

sammy

[oldcodger]

Hi,

Glad to hear you have got that problem sorted , sure the info will be of use to someone, sometime.

What about your more 'pressing' problem - any progress, cannot see the crossed rear lines would affect the pedal pressure ..?

[sammy20]

Hi,

From my limited exerience of doing brakes you have to be mega sure everythings 100% cos when it fails its one of the most sickening feelings when you are doing 30mph approaching a T junction ! ( in my younger days of car repairs! )

Testing and using a 12 year old rubber seal in a 12 year old cylinder bore would not give me the greatest confidence.

When you say the brake pedal sinks to the floor, do you mean you put your foot on it and it literally goes to the floor on that same stroke or if you are at a standstill with the engine running you place your foot hard on the pedal and over 5 -30 seconds the pedal slowly sinks down ?

When it sinks down, what happens if you quicky release the pedal and then immediately press down once again, ( pump) does the pressure return and hold or sink down again ?

If you are sure its not the master cylinder or ballooning of the rubber brake hoses, perhaps its a fault with the abs unit, but afaid I have no idea of if function or potential problems, perhaps someone else can help out there ..

hi,

thanks for your suggestion mate . i done a test on the master cylinder by plugging the the two outlets on the master cylinder and removing the abs fuse then turn the engine on and the brake pedal was hard as a rock no way you can push it down .maybe I'm wrong with this test but as far as i know the MC and the booster are SPOT ON!

what happens if you quicky release the pedal and then immediately press down once again, ( pump) does the pressure return and hold or sink down again ?

when i push the pedal down with engine off the pedal hard as a rock then when i turn engine one and push the brake pedal the pedal goes down to the floor it makes a noticeable hiss noise ...hiss hiss hiss then engine off 2 to 3 push hard as a rock.

when i pump the brake pedal with engine on it will not get hard just still the same hiss hiss hiss the car do stop but not great as the way it used to be.

The rubber brake hoses are hard but i will have to check them again just to be sure.

again thanks a lot mate.

sammy

[sammy20]

Are any of the rubber connection hoses bubbiling under the pressure?

thanks for your suggestion mate .The rubber brake hoses are hard but i will have to check them again just to be sure.

please could you check inside your car to see if it has the same connection to the proportioning valve.

thanks mate

sammy

[sammy20]

Hi,

Glad to hear you have got that problem sorted , sure the info will be of use to someone, sometime.

What about your more 'pressing' problem - any progress, cannot see the crossed rear lines would affect the pedal pressure ..?

thanks mate. i'm still waiting on the abs unit it should be with me soon. yes that's right the crossed rear lines wouldn't effect the pedal pressure but it would damage the abs unit and wheel speed sensors which is more expensive than the car itself lol.

with this problem i have learned a lot about brake system and also learned the hard way not to trust any mechanic i mean it now not even dealers one mistake and things could turn ugly ...but i will chase the root of this problem and update on this matter.

sammy

[sammy20]

***********update*********** good news and bad news

hi guys,

i installed the abs unit from scrappers.disconnect negative Battery then bleed the brake system with pressure bleeder (Gunson bleeder) using spare Tyre this is done without pimping the brake pedal . front right + rear left and front left + rear right .put everything together start the car now the abs light off but the bad news the red brake warning light on and no more spongy brake pedal but probably i have to bleed them again just to be sure.

so,why is the red brake warning light on?!

Note:

the part number on the abs unit was not the same number as the old abs unit but the seller says that will fit no problem as long as no abs warning light on.

so, maybe wrong abs unit or wrong orientation of the rear pipes on proportioning valve i need to find the same year and model to see the orientation of these pipes because the one i found on the scrappers older model........what a mess! stupid Mechanic but it was my fault.

please any suggestion to solve this problem.

sammy