Rav4 2.0 D4D Xt-R 5Door 05 Plate With Big Problems

[pw100]

Cheers mate. Note to self........don't start too soon on the ale when you're wound up and asking for peoples help . Stop's you getting peoples names mixed up .

Thanks again

paul

[Big Kev]

Hopefully ends up being Paultry problems.......

[doujoy1944]

Hi guy's,

I once went out to a car with the some sort of problem, because you have perminent four wheel drive any part of that drives failure will result in not being able to get the car to move, it feels like clutch or flywheel failure but it is not, the fact that you are able to start and run the engine rules out the timing belt.

Without checking the car myself I would say you have striped the drive splines out of one or both of your front wheel drive hubs, hence the almost move and then no movement at all.

Doug.

[gjnorthall]

PW100 states that the engine stopped suddenly and it has not been possible to start the engine since. This could well be a cambelt failure and it's an easy task to either confirm or rule out. The loss of drive appears to be something quite separate - it may well be a DMF failure but clearly this would need to be confirmed before removing the gearbox. With the car in 1st gear it should be possible to turn the crankshaft pulley and determine where in the train the drive is being lost.

[CharlieFarlie]

My name's Gareth and my background is in garage services. In recent years I've focused on spares and repair of Japanese imports. My interest in Ravs and this forum is that I've had a few of them - basically to get to and from where I live in winter weather. The best was a 4.1 which I imported new from Cyprus and had around 200000 miles on the clock when I sold it - it's still around several years on! As well as general maintenance and repairs, I've rebuilt several diesel engines to date - Ravs that suffered from the oil burning / head gasket issues but didn't qualify for a Toyota engine replacement. As you can imagine many such cars have been quickly traded in or sold at auction only for the new owner to discover the problem a short time later!

Gareth. I would be interested to know your findings when opening up the engines mentioned above please ?

Also for the benefit of present and future members could you indicate a cost for rectification of such an engine ? We are told its a complex unit which the dealer technicians had a...well not 100% success rate with ...

Your posts are informative and easy to understand mate but the text you write in is very hard to read on a phone....

Thanks !!!

[gjnorthall]

First of all – it’s worth remembering that this isn’t the first time that Toyota has come up

against the issue of heavy oil consumption. In the not too distant past there were significant problems
with the VVti petrol engine – particularily the 1.8 litre version as fitted to
the likes of the Celica. In the early 2000’s cars fitted with similar engines – such as the Avensis
suffered serious problems to such a degree that some owners were bulk buying
oil in 25litre drums. There was much denial that a problem existed but
eventually Toyota, in a low key way, introduced a 7 year, 112000mile extended
warranty against the oil consumption issue. Initially dealers attempted to fit
new pistons / rings but after mixed success – moved to fitting new /
reconditioned short motors to affected cars. Does this sound familiar to many
of you? With petrol engines however, there were few consequential issues – it
was really a case of the cost and inconvenience of high oil consumption. Owners often added to their problems by using products claimed to reduce oil consumption and often used the cheapest oil they could find whatever the spec!

The cause of the problem resulted from the drive to increase power and efficiency by reducing
weight and friction. The understanding is that the oil control ring on the piston was a fairly flimsy
item which was subject to excessive wear so with a few thousand miles on the
clock – the oil control rings became inefficient and excessive oil got into the combustion chamber.

Move on a few years and it appears that Toyota’s oil issue with petrol engines has been sorted but a
similar problem raises it’s head for the first time on a diesel – the AD engine
fitted to several Toyota models including the Rav4. With a diesel the consequential problems are far more
significant than a petrol – including failed head gaskets, blocked EGR systems etc. Toyotas eventual response was exactly the same as previous – a warranty extension to 7 years / 112000 miles. The action level on oil consumption was 0.5litre/1000km as previously. Again Toyota tackled the problem
on affected cars by replacing pistons / rings but with mixed results and eventually fitted new / reconditioned short motors.

When these engines are stripped – the heavy build up of carbon and degraded oil on the piston crown
and cylinder head is pretty obvious. Carbon gets into the ring grooves and there’s evidence of restriction in the drains holes behind the oil control rings.

Our choice to resolve the problem is to fit new Kolbenschmidt pistons and rings. Generally it’s
possible to fit standard size pistons and glaze bust / cross hatch the bores
but ovality can be an issue at high mileage. In this case we’d bore +0.5mm and
fit oversize pistons. It’s also possible to re-sleeve the bores – not something
I’ve done on this engine. There are other options in terms of piston choice
including Toyota parts but Kolbenschmidt are superb pistons but are expensive.

For a retail customer
– total cost would be around £2000 which would include the work described above,
refacing the head, all new gaskets and seals, all new bearings, new timing belt
/ tensioner / coolant pump, reconditioned oil pump, machine polish crankshaft
journals, clean / test injectors,
lubricants/ consumables /coolant, ultrasonic cleaning and solvent flush of the
block, remove / install engine.

The bottom line of all this is that a local engine machine shop can recondition your engine (look for
an FER member). It’s not cheap, but worth it if you’ve got a Rav which is otherwise good, and you’d like
to keep it – may be a much better option than a p.ex + £2000 tradeup!

[Big Kev]

Respeck min.........AND in legible type too..........!

[Davrav]

Informative and good to know there is an alternative for those who suffer issues outside the extended warranty Gareth.

Not cheap but, as you say, could be quite cost effective in the long run.

What feedback have you had from those who have had this remedy - mpg, reliability etc.?

[anchorman]

I've somehow missed this post.

Firstly, I've noticed how helpful Gareth's posts can be and delighted to have somebody else on board theis section that can help out with the technical stuff. For that reason by way of thanks I've awarded a star even after so few posts. It might seem a bit paltry but Gareth, having you here really is appreciated.

As far as this engine problem goes, if the DMF has fouled the back of the crank case like Chatter's did then I woonder if the timing belt has skipped or broken and I would have the front cover off before the head.

[voyager t180]

Along with Don & co. great to have another knowledgeable member on board.

This is Gareth's third or fourth technical info post,and again informative and to the point..Somehow I seem to have one star,so I reckon he deserves at least two;-)

[CharlieFarlie]

Great reply from Gareth once again.. Thanks for the type change also !

One question.. Does the 2AD engine have a belt or chain drive for the cams ? Text above suggests belt ? I was convinced it was by chain...

Cheers.

[gjnorthall]

Thank you for your warm welcome!

In answer to some of the issues raised about the 2AD engine problems.........................

- The 2.0 litre diesel up to end 2005 had a belt driven cam – the later 2AE 2.2 engine has a chain

driven cam. This system requires no maintenance but the chain can rattle a bit at high mileage – and if necessary, it’s not a cheap item to replace. Chain life is assured by using good quality engine oil and changing oil and filter at the prescribed interval - it's easy to starve the chain of oil by gunging up the oilways in this area.

- Belts can fail prematurely for many reasons – starting the engine puts the biggest load on a cambelt and a belt on it’s last legs will often fail as you turn the key. The teeth will strip around the crankshaft pulley and a quick look will indicate that the belt is intact - always check that the belt is actually turning the camshaft!

- The engines that I rebuilt all ran quietly, were all fine when they came back at 1000 miles and never returned under warranty - so must be a good sign! I don't have any knowledge of MPG, but after bedding in, I would expect comparable consumption to a Toyota remanufactured engine. At the last check - the all in cost of a fitted Toyota remanufactured engine was over £3000.

The one Rav I did see after the rebuild was a retail job - it was an otherwise mint 57 reg car but with high miles. It had been a private sale and had run OK for a while apart from drinking oil which the owner attributed to the mileage. When I got the car, the head gasket had failed and it transpired when stripping that the gasket had been replaced previously. A new turbocharger had been fitted in the not too distant past and given the reliability of this particular unit - I'm guessing that it was replaced as being the cause of oil consumption. All in all - someone had spent quite a bit of money on fixing but without getting to the root cause. 30k miles later - the car runs well and according to the owner - uses a cupfull of oil between services.