Hybrid and heavy stop and go traffic

[16_Auris_HSD]

5 hours ago, Anthony Poli said:

One thing you could try using, is the hybrid assistant. Recently I have seen the optimum points in power dial give the most ice recharge and the amount of regen gained from different amounts of pressure on the brake pedal.

Also it shows how much power the electric motor is using.
With this new information, I have managed to do my commute and between 47 & 63 % of my journey can be done without fuel. Stop starts going up a steep hill will drain the battery without you trying.

Weirdly Auris hybrids doesn't come with hybrid assistant. It sounds like a useful thing though.

[Anthony Poli]

I’m sorry
Maybe I should have explained that it is an Android app that’s used with a obd device. It will record your journey, as well as show you a live display.
It works with all Toyota hybrids.


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[kithmo]

I'd advise not to use a bluetooth OBD device when out and about, your car systems can be hacked through it by a close proximity hacker (i.e. in traffic).

[Anthony Poli]

I'd advise not to use a bluetooth OBD device when out and about, your car systems can be hacked through it by a close proximity hacker (i.e. in traffic).

Any idea what they could do?
I haven’t heard of any stories of what could be done to the car.


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[danowat]

That would have to be a heck of a set of circumstances for that to happen, are bluetooth OBD units widespread enough to warrant people going to the effort of sniffing them?

What would be the end goal of them doing it?.

[Cyker]

At the moment it's probably not something worth worrying about; bluetooth is supposed to be a short-range protocol and given it's inside a car the radio transmissions will be mostly shielded from the outside world.

Although saying that, out of curiosity, how far from the car does the app work on your phone?

Personally, I'm more worried about the more advanced stuff like what you see in newer BMWs and Tesla that is starting to be more prevalent - They run over mobile phone links and can give the manufacturer full access to everything in the car. I am dreading the point where *they* get hacked!
 

[Anthony Poli]

At the moment it's probably not something worth worrying about; Bluetooth is supposed to be a short-range protocol and given it's inside a car the radio transmissions will be mostly shielded from the outside world.
Although saying that, out of curiosity, how far from the car does the app work on your phone?

Personally, I'm more worried about the more advanced stuff like what you see in newer BMWs and Tesla that is starting to be more prevalent - They run over mobile phone links and can give the manufacturer full access to everything in the car. I am dreading the point where *they* get hacked!
 

Too far, I have gone to my car and noticed the dongle was plugged into the other car 15 metres away.

If the dongles only support one connection at the time, surely the app would report a loss in connection or data packets.


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[16_Auris_HSD]

18 hours ago, Anthony Poli said:

I’m sorry
Maybe I should have explained that it is an Android app that’s used with a obd device. It will record your journey, as well as show you a live display.
It works with all Toyota hybrids.

No worries. I thought you were referring to Gen 4 which can display stats that aren't available in Auris.

 

 

[kithmo]

7 hours ago, Anthony Poli said:

 

Any idea what they could do?
I haven’t heard of any stories of what could be done to the car.


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They can do anything you can do with a laptop and app and with the correct software they can reprogram various ECUs if they feel like it.

Call me paranoid but it's more the mischief aspect of it I am worried about, I wouldn't want someone to brick my car's ABS ECU for example whilst I was driving.  

Unless your bluetooth adapter has the capability to change the bluetooth connection key then I would not use it, most are preset to something easy to remember (and crack) like 0000 or 1111 etc.

[barrycoll]

For Pulse & Glide, 2-3 car lengths are all that is required dear 16-auris....in fact, just move off when the vehicle in front does, with just enough right foot to bring the power bar to beyond the EV position and the ICE on......then depending on the traffic, right off the throttle to bring on the EV and glide......the hybrid assistant can also be helpful, but do try not to looking at it when the traffic has stopped

 

As for Mways, well the reason the traffic becomes Stop/Start, is that folks travel to closely and have to apply their brakes, causing a snake of earlier and earlier braking, and finally a Stop.......

As a senior observer for the IAM (now Roadsmart), and having taken a lady in Range Rover out this morning in preparation for her Test, I continued to encourage her to keep enough space to the row of vehicles in front, that if brake lights came on, she could just use engine braking to allow time for any holdups to clear, without touching her brake pedal. So no surprises for anything following

Many of my friends seem it find it anathema to leave both a stopping and thinking distance to the vehicle in front, and leave them selves exposed to that little word,  “suddenly”.

 

[PeteB]

5 minutes ago, barrycoll said:

... Many of my friends seem it find it anathema to leave both a stopping and thinking distance to the vehicle in front, and leave them selves exposed to that little word,  “suddenly”.

Oh yes!  So true.

Also, one of the many reasons I have a Dashcam is that so many people, having passed me (while exceeding the speed limit *), pull into a gap leaving just a few feet between my car and theirs.  If they then had to "suddenly" brake because an animal, child etc had run in front of them before I had time to increase separation, hey'd be trying to say it was my fault because I was following too close!

[OT - do you know if exceeding speed limits if still a criminal offence Barry?  I think it is, but hard to keep up]

[barrycoll]

Well if it is Pete, my Range Rover lady would now be languishing in Jail......plus a clutch of Penalty Points

but we did routinely stop with a view of the tyre  contact patches of the vehicle in front, allowing for an accidental engagement of Reverse, or getting thumped from behind, although , once again, a lot of friends consider this “free-space’ quite anti social.

In my book a tail end prang is anti social, and the only thing one can do with those folks who insist in jumping ahead of your new Mark 4 Pete, is to see it developing , and so dont get involved in someone else’s accident.

Of course, we have drifted far from the OP’s problem of poor Auris  mpg in traffic

[Anthony Poli]

Well if it is Pete, my Range Rover lady would now be languishing in Jail......plus a clutch of Penalty Points
but we did routinely stop with a view of the tyre  contact patches of the vehicle in front, allowing for an accidental engagement of Reverse, or getting thumped from behind, although , once again, a lot of friends consider this “free-space’ quite anti social.
In my book a tail end prang is anti social, and the only thing one can do with those folks who insist in jumping ahead of your new Mark 4 Pete, is to see it developing , and so dont get involved in someone else’s accident.
Of course, we have drifted far from the OP’s problem of poor Auris  mpg in traffic

I use the same tyres on tarmac method for the same reason and it also allows me the space to let the car smoothly pull away on electric.


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[MEP's Yaris GS]

On 11/7/2017 at 9:48 AM, johalareewi said:

Back from hols.  To chip in with a couple of notes:

B Mode on the non-plugin hybrids does not boost battery charging (despite what MrT sales staff say) it turns on engine braking to waste energy.

B mode on a plug in prius does boost battery charging but only when in EV mode.  When in HV mode B mode behaves as above.

News to me. Never tried this. Will have to on the way into work tomorrow in EV. Can't see if being any better using B mode than using the regen braking properly to be honest.

[MEP's Yaris GS]

On 11/6/2017 at 2:56 PM, 16_Auris_HSD said:

Plug-in Toyota hybrids use B to aid regen apparently.

Nope not from personal experience. Just revs the engine back and holds you back on long down hills. Far better off in D maxing out the regen breaking. Can gain some serious range that way (when I'm not in flat Norfolk anyway).

[PeteB]

10 hours ago, MEP's Yaris GS said:

... not in flat Norfolk anyway).

Flat!?  Wanna borrow my bike and see how flat it is!  

[johalareewi]

On 09/11/2017 at 10:37 PM, MEP's Yaris GS said:

Nope not from personal experience. Just revs the engine back and holds you back on long down hills. Far better off in D maxing out the regen breaking. Can gain some serious range that way (when I'm not in flat Norfolk anyway).

It does if you are in EV mode.

You can see it on hybrid assistant. Put it in B while in HV mode, the ICE spins.  Put it in B while in EV mode, the charge going to the Battery jumps up.

However, by pumping more into the HV Battery, you rapidly decrease the ability of the system to absorb all the electricity being generated (you can see this on hybrid assistant too).

 

[QuantumFireball]

On 07/11/2017 at 9:48 AM, johalareewi said:

B mode on a plug in prius does boost battery charging but only when in EV mode.  When in HV mode B mode behaves as above.

I've found B in the Plug-In in HV mode also increases regen as it does in EV mode when driving at low speeds, maybe <35 km/h or so. The ICE only kicks in at speeds higher than this.

And in EV mode with B, you don't need Hybrid Assistant to see the increased regen - even just looking at the normal HSI bar on the dash you'll see it going into the "CHG" bar more than normal when you're off the throttle.

[MEP's Yaris GS]

Well I've just tried it in my PiP in EV mode. In my opinion no benefit to using it over the regen braking with the pedal, and it'll actually be less efficient than leaving it in D and coasting with no power use or regen, as every time to draw from the Battery, or put back, you'll be getting energy losses ultimatly.

[johalareewi]

On 13/11/2017 at 12:30 PM, MEP's Yaris GS said:

Well I've just tried it in my PiP in EV mode. In my opinion no benefit to using it over the regen braking with the pedal, and it'll actually be less efficient than leaving it in D and coasting with no power use or regen, as every time to draw from the battery, or put back, you'll be getting energy losses ultimatly.

Probably not.  At the end of the day both methods use regen braking.  I suspect the logic behind it is B mode gives you extra continuous braking (like on long descents).  Normally this is done by spinning the ICE but when you are in EV mode in the PIP,  the system probably reckons it is better to push more energy into the HV Battery rather than waste it spinning the ICE.

[QuantumFireball]

On 13/11/2017 at 12:30 PM, MEP's Yaris GS said:

Well I've just tried it in my PiP in EV mode. In my opinion no benefit to using it over the regen braking with the pedal...

When you use the brake pedal you never really know how much braking effort is regen and how much is "friction braking" - the ratio is non-linear and depends on various conditions. Unless you're monitoring brake pressure from the OBD-II port, or something. B in EV mode will always be just regen, at least.

[Anthony Poli]

When you use the brake pedal you never really know how much braking effort is regen and how much is "friction braking" - the ratio is non-linear and depends on various conditions. Unless you're monitoring brake pressure from the OBD-II port, or something. B in EV mode will always be just regen, at least.

I can vouch for that, with using hybrid assistant. It’s the same scenario with using the ice, you can’t guarantee at what point on the dial, will you get the optimum charge. So far I haven’t managed to get as close as you get from, braking to achieve the most beneficial regen.


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[MEP's Yaris GS]

On 11/20/2017 at 3:03 PM, QuantumFireball said:

When you use the brake pedal you never really know how much braking effort is regen and how much is "friction braking" - the ratio is non-linear and depends on various conditions. Unless you're monitoring brake pressure from the OBD-II port, or something. B in EV mode will always be just regen, at least.

I beg to differ, from experience the brakes are only engaged if you've maxed out the regen bar, brake harshly or are coming to a complete stop and traveling below 7-8mph.

[Anthony Poli]

From my experiences our hybrids behave differently. The Yaris seems to switch to the friction brakes much sooner and without pressing as hard on the pedal. The Auris in comparison you can press a lot harder, plus the amount of regen is more than double, driving the exact same route at the same time of day.


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[thecaretaker]

Hi 16_Auris_HSD, Just watched that YouTube video you posted and noticed, I don't have that cool split screen function on the meter customisation screen on my Gen 4 Excel. Is this a US only feature or do some UK models have it as well?