Gen 2/Gen 3/Auris/CT200H - Which would you chose?

[danowat]

No idea how true it is, but I was once told by an air-con tech that if any air-con system needs re-gassing, then it's indicative of an issue with the system that re-gassing won't fix, or will fix for a short amount of time.

[Otispunkmeyer]

I think that depends. 

I think a system that has seen regular use should be good for years and years. Its systems that don't get regular use that often have issues. 

However, refrigerant is slippery stuff and I would expect it, over a long time frame, to gradually decline via some means.

Still, I think I would err with you and that there is probably a small leak somewhere. That or the condenser needs a good clean out. 

[Otispunkmeyer]

Where can I buy this:

00289 ACRKT

Toyota AC Evaporator Cleaning Kit - Seems to be easy to find if you are US based. But I can't see anything in the UK.

[QuantumFireball]

Maybe check with your dealer? Sometimes items here have different part numbers if they're sourced from within Europe.

[PeteB]

or PM Parts King and give him your VIN and/or Reg number.

[Otispunkmeyer]

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Wurth-Air-Conditioning-Disinfectant-Spray/dp/B00KVHPOG2

 

that should do it I think. Its a similar product. Will have to fashion something to connect it to the drain pipe so it doesn't spill. I know it says spray, but I think that is a function of the translation. The instructions call for squirting it up the drain pipe and not down through the cabin vents. I see  a number of products that say to squirt the spray or even foam down the vents and I just can't see how that is a good idea? surely it'll leak out of any joins in the plastic ducting along the way?

 

I already rang our nearest toyota dealer and they didn't know anything about it. Useless.

[Otispunkmeyer]

Hmmm going to start a new thread about the AC I think. It's definitely not right. I couldn't get it to give cool air at all today on the way home. Not nice when it's 32 deg outside.

I've got some video of what it's doing, but in essence it does this:

Recirc button light and outside air button light start to alternate.

I can hear fans coming on at the front (presume condenser fans) and I can hear the compressor coming on. But they're cycling on and off with very short period, like it's tripping and resetting over and over. 

Perhaps it's running into some limit ie pressure too high in the refrigerant loop. It's ok when cool, but when the car has sat and baked all afternoon that's enough temperature to kick it over the edge.

Either way I think it's probably a job for Toyota.

[PeteB]

3 hours ago, Otispunkmeyer said:

Recirc button light and outside air button light start to alternate.

I wonder if that's giving some sort of error message?

[Otispunkmeyer]

29 minutes ago, PeteB said:

I wonder if that's giving some sort of error message?

My thoughts too but its not a consistent flash. I caught it very very briefly flicking to recirc and then back to outside air (where it stayed for maybe 5 seconds). It seems to coincide with the compressor spooling up.... like the ECU has decided, right cool down time, set fan high, set recirc and AC on. Which is normal for fast cool down or when you set absolute lowest temperature. So its flicking between modes.

I think if there was an AC error then the AC light would flash (as per what I've read about AC errors on the Gen 2... I don't think they'd change that). As I say, no error codes for the climate ECU show up when its doing this.

As I posted in my other thread, coming home from the pool tonight it worked more or less as you expect AC to work. It took a little long to get cool, but once it did it seemed to stay that way. When I got back onto my drive I noted the compressor whirring away constantly, not coming in and out. You only expect that when you're asking maximum of it. So it seems there is an ambient temperature element to all this. The common theme is it seems to cool OK, albeit working flat out, when its cool in the mornings/evenings. But during the day when its scorchio it absolutely doesn't work at all.

Ill be ringing Toyota and asking to speak to a tech who knows about these cars in the morning.

[Otispunkmeyer]

First tank full has been consumed. Can't remember the trip mileage but it was around 410 miles (bit less maybe) and a computer economy of 59.2 MPG. 33 odd litres to fill it back up (had 2 bars left) and its worked out by hand to a smidge under 56 MPG. Very happy with that for the kind of driving its doing and now its got decent tyres on it and correct pressures and I am getting my eye in, I think I can nudge that a little higher.

This is such an easy, relaxing machine to drive. Literally no stress. Don't even care for being stuck in traffic anymore as you just let the thing creep along on Battery and just relax!

[danowat]

11 hours ago, Otispunkmeyer said:

 

This is such an easy, relaxing machine to drive. Literally no stress. Don't even care for being stuck in traffic anymore as you just let the thing creep along on battery and just relax!

Yeah, that's one of the most pleasant things about them, they are very refined if you keep the HSI from pushing too much into the PWR range.

[PeteB]

12 hours ago, Otispunkmeyer said:

This is such an easy, relaxing machine to drive. Literally no stress. Don't even care for being stuck in traffic anymore as you just let the thing creep along on battery and just relax!

When I got my first Prius over 16 years ago, I mainly chatted to owners all over the world on a Yahoo chat group, and a very common thread was that because of the calming nature of the car many owners found themselves driving in a much more chilled manner, not racing away from traffic lights, not straying over the speed limit (a new experience for many!) and as you say feeling much less stress even when being held up.  Not because of any limitation in the car's ability, just because they felt no need.

Indeed, four years later when I became a Prius minicab driver in London for a year, as the first Eco friendly firm in London, we got a lot of prestige clients who were used to being driven in machinery close to £100k, rather than the £17k or so a Gen 2 Prius cost in those days.  Many of them commented how much less stressed they felt when running late for something, and quite a few acquired their own Prius.  I personally found it the least stressful job I ever had!

[PeteB]

37 minutes ago, danowat said:

Yeah, that's one of the most pleasant things about them, they are very refined if you keep the HSI from pushing too much into the PWR range.

I find that squeezing the loud pedal quickly rather than stamping on it can produce full power without as much RPM and it stays relatively refined (more so than many autos in kick-down).

It feels to me as if the car's computers are recognising how I'm pressing the pedal as well as how much.

[danowat]

Yup, I agree, up to a point, but there is always a point where the engine seems to be screaming away if you go too far!

[kithmo]

30 minutes ago, danowat said:

Yup, I agree, up to a point, but there is always a point where the engine seems to be screaming away if you go too far!

A lot less so with the Gen 4

[danowat]

Just now, kithmo said:

A lot less so with the Gen 4

I still can't get over the looks of the Gen 4, hopefully it will grow on me before I decide on a new car!

[PeteB]

5 minutes ago, kithmo said:

A lot less so with the Gen 4

Each new generation of Toyota Hybrid System has done better than the last in terms of using less RPM in a given circumstance.

In the original 1997 Japanese Domestic model, the ICE was limited to just 4,000 rpm, which went up to 4,500 for the Gen 1 launched in Europe three years later.  The Gen 2 saw this rise to 5,000, but in each case the actual revs used in a given circumstance was around 500 less than the superseded version.

Each of the first four variants was also faster in top speed and 0-60, the Gen 4 (which is really Gen 5 in absolute terms if you include the JDM original) being the first to buck the trend with same top speed and 0.2 sec longer to 60 (but somehow quicker in the mid range acceleration - go figure!).

I found it amusing that the fudged top speed of the first 3 European models was the same as the actual limited speed of the following model:

• Gen 1: 99 actual/106 speedo
• Gen 2: 106/112
• Gen 3: 112/120

As I say, the Gen 4 didn't follow this trend.  BTW, I didn't test these figures out myself!

[Catlover]

34 minutes ago, danowat said:

I still can't get over the looks of the Gen 4, hopefully it will grow on me before I decide on a new car!

I always liked the rear 3/4 of a Gen4, but the front looked like a crash waiting to be repaired.  I eventually got over that, so I bought a Gen4 but in Red and the crash bits (surrounding daytime lights) doesn't seem so pronounced.

I loved my Gen3 but the Gen4 is at a higher level still.

[QuantumFireball]

14 hours ago, Otispunkmeyer said:

First tank full has been consumed. Can't remember the trip mileage but it was around 410 miles (bit less maybe) and a computer economy of 59.2 MPG. 33 odd litres to fill it back up (had 2 bars left)...

Just something to note is that it's a 45 litre tank, and when it goes down to one bar and starts beeping there are about 9 litres left in the tank. You can safely do another 50 miles or so, after the "distance to empty" has gone to 0! It's very over-cautious about range.

[Otispunkmeyer]

4 hours ago, danowat said:

I still can't get over the looks of the Gen 4, hopefully it will grow on me before I decide on a new car!

The plug in version is much easier on the eye. The cynic in me says that they knew the 4 was a bit of a munter and so quickly set about doing something about it for the plug-in!

But, you can't see it from the inside and the inside looks fine!

[Otispunkmeyer]

3 hours ago, QuantumFireball said:

Just something to note is that it's a 45 litre tank, and when it goes down to one bar and starts beeping there are about 9 litres left in the tank. You can safely do another 50 miles or so, after the "distance to empty" has gone to 0! It's very over-cautious about range.

Yeah, when I picked it up it was on zero so I nursed it over to the nearest petrol station to find I only put 40 litres in it! So still a gallon in the tank!

[danowat]

1 minute ago, Otispunkmeyer said:

The plug in version is much easier on the eye. The cynic in me says that they knew the 4 was a bit of a munter and so quickly set about doing something about it for the plug-in!

But, you can't see it from the inside and the inside looks fine!

Yeah, the plug in does look better, but I still think I'd see it outside my house and shudder!, it's just a really ugly car!