ABL

Avensis 2.2l diesel starting problem

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Hi everyone, I have just joined the club and this is my first post. Can someone please help me with a problem I have had with my 2006 Avensis. I have had the car since 2007 and it has covered about 75000 miles, so low mileage really. The car became difficult to start about 12 months ago. The starter motor will turn the engine over but the engine will not pick up to idling revs. This does not happen all the time, in fact when the engine is cold it normally starts first time, but I have got into the habit of pressing the priming button by the side of the engine until I feel resistance, then turn the key until the glowplug indicator goes out, switch off and get the glowplug indicator to come on again. Then I turn the key fully round. Normally the engine will start. I have had the car into a garage and they said the fuel filter was blocked and replaced it. Afterwards when I picked the car up the engine started immediately two or three times in succession. By this time though the engine had cooled down. It seemed to start OK for a while but I could sense a slight delay at times when starting. I have checked the resistance of the glowplugs and they all read the same and I have carried out a spark test on each to prove a current is flowing. After 2 or 3 attempts at starting when I feel the Battery is beginning to struggle, jumping it off another vehicle starts it much better. Any ideas, please?

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Welcome to the club,

What happens when you just try to start the car normally, without the added bells and whistles?

Ian

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Hi Ian, thanks for replying. Sometimes it will burst into life, but it seems to take a few extra milliseconds holding the key over before it does get going. Up to last year it was straight up to idling speed. There has been times when it will start after a few turns of the key, but you can tell that the Battery starts to struggle. Thanks again.

Alan

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Hi Alan, I'm still not clear on what exactly is happening. Is the behaviour you describe while the starter is engaged? Once running dues the car run ok? Smoke? Misfiring when cold? When you say getting up to idle speed is this on the starter or once the engine has fired? Without a very detailed and accurate description of what's happening is very difficult to envisage what the issue might be

Ian

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Ian, when it is running the car behaves brilliantly - idles smoothly and quietly, no smoke, no misfiring, either hot or cold and does around 50 - 55mpg on a good run. But it does emit a cloud of whitish/greyish smoke if it doesn't start first time. It cannot get to idling speed on the starter. When it doesn't start first time -you turn the key and hear the starter turning, a few revs show on the rev counter but that's it the engine doesn't start to turn and speed up to idling speed. It stops turning obviously when you've stopped turning the key and let it return to start position. Occassionally there is a judder whilst the engine is turning on the starter, and at this point I let the starter key return to start position, as I don't want to stress any part of the starter motor. Will this site allow video clips to be shown as that may be the only way to show what's happening here. Someone has suggested it could be the starter motor, but I would have thought it would have failed completely before now. Thanks for your interest, Ian.

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Out of interest how old is the Battery?

The puff of whitish/greyish smoke is probably unburnt diesel from the failed start. I would have thought. is your car a 150 or 180 bhp model?

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Is the 2.2 engine the version that had head gasket issues? White smoke could potentially be water on the start up? If the car is running fine once started then it could rule this suggestion out. 

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When checking the glow plugs, they should go red on their tip only, not the entire section.

Diesel engines require higher starting current from the Battery. Check the the Battery can deliver the starting [cranking ] current. Charge the Battery fully and have it checked if it can delivered the rated current output. Failing that, I would replace the Battery.

Another possibility is the relay which comes on when the engine is at a certain temperature at which this relay supplies current to the glow plugs.

Chris.

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Thanks for the replies. The Bosch Battery is about 3 years old and I have had it checked twice, once at the motor factor's shop I bought it from and once at a local motor discount centre and both said it was in good condition. The car is the 150BHP model. I have had a voltmeter on the supply conductor bar to the glowplugs and that indicates a voltage at the same time as the dash board indicator. I have not removed the glowplugs after carrying out the two tests with them in position - resistance of each approx 1.9ohms, and doing the spark test to prove currect flow. I keep thinking it is a fuel problem - not getting the correct pressure and flow at the injectors on start up ie due to passing injectors or something else. I know very little about injector problems.  I am going to check the starter motor if it is not too difficult to remove. Any further advice is very welcome. Thanks to all again.

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So, if it's a 2006 150BHP 2.2 I suspect that it is highly unlikely to be a D-CAT & therefore unlikely to have any form of DPF. Just to be sure if you open your bonnet on the engine cover does it say D4D or D-CAT?

It's in the back  of my mind that there may be a software update for this (it boosts the pressure, possibly a revised injector too) but Devon Aygo would be your man. Or on searching it could be this 

 

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Hi Scott, It is a D4D model. I have just read all the attached posts concerning different model Toyotas having starting problems. It sounds like my problem could be the SCV.  Do you know of any particular risks if I try one of the remedies tried by one post ie cleaning and lubricating the valve with WD40 or carburetor cleaneer to see if it improves the problem before I book it into a garage for new valve and software upgrade. Obviously I would prefer to find out if it is this valve rather than another part that ws causing the problem as noting some of the costs they are not cheap. Thankyou very much for your reply.

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If you feel competent to do it I can't think of any particular risk but it's your car so your decision ... 😛

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Thanks Scott. It was just the fuel pressure held in the pipework - I'm told it is very high, so I probably need to be very careful when breaking any pipework or device joints. Over the years I have stripped petrol engines - both cars and motorbikes, but never messed with diesel engines, but I'll have a look and get a feel for what I intend to do. Thanks again.

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Can I please ask if anyone has used the fuel additive called Archoil AR6400-D MAX to clean any deposits of carbon in the diesel fuel system if they are having problems. The information that goes with it says it can clean up EGRs, DPFs, CATs and improve performance. BUT does it work, because it is quite expensive.

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I used to when I had my 2.2s. In fact, I think that I still have an unopened bottle (I changed cars unexpectedly soon) if you want to drop me a PM.

Of course the ideal is not to let carbon build up in the first place.

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Hi Scott, not sure how I drop you a PM from this forum, sorry.

 

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OK, I have sent you one.

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Hi my 2005 avensis d4d 2l diesel has had hot starting issues, had Battery and go plugs checked, fitted a bosh starter motor and cured the problem instantly only to reappear 2 years later, I was told by a mechanic there is a design issue. The starter motor is mounted too close to the engine and overheats and breaks down then it won't crank over fast enough. The replacement starter motor from Toyota has been redisgned to cope with this. But is expensive. 👍😢

 

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On 2/26/2019 at 11:15 AM, ABL said:

Can I please ask if anyone has used the fuel additive called Archoil AR6400-D MAX to clean any deposits of carbon in the diesel fuel system if they are having problems. The information that goes with it says it can clean up EGRs, DPFs, CATs and improve performance. BUT does it work, because it is quite expensive.

I have used Archoil products for the last couple years, but I don’t think the one you mention. Currently I using AR 6200 which is for petrol and diesel. Price seems a lot but then it’s only 5ml every 50 litres of petrol/diesel. When you first use it recommends 10ml for every 50 litre of fuel. I had to buy a 10ml blunt needle injector for it - no way to guess 10ml never mind 5 ml.

Does it work? My Gen4 Prius seems very lively and I get very good mpg - high 70’s just recently with warmer weather. The wife has a 2010 Auris hybrid and that seems to do well. 

I will stick with Archoil, and consider any new products they bring out.

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Alan Abl,  

Just been checking the reviews for Archoil 6400 and they all seem good. Go to www.powerenhancer.co.uk and check the Archoil products out. Powerhenancer also gives a discount if you join the (free) club, as well as other discounts.

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Hi Rupert Huxley, thankyou very much for your message. This sounds very much like my problem, although the car starts straight away at times. I have had the Battery checked twice - it is a Bosch one now about 3 years old, and I have just found one of the glowplugs failed. Did you replace yours yourself or take it to a garage? I intended to take the starter motor off at the weekend but ran out of time and it looks quite a difficult job to remove. Did you have to remove loads of other things to take it out? Cheers again.

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Hi Joe, thanks for the lowdown on the Archoil. Alan

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Hi Alan,

I have a similar problem with my 2006 2.2 150 non DPF avensis.

I posted a video on my Youtube channel to show other owners. I tried pouring hot water over the SCV, unfortunately that didn't make any difference. My car always starts but even in summer I have to wait for the heater plugs to go out before trying to start. I intend to replace the heater plugs in the next few months as he car has 160,000 miles and the plugs have never been replaced.

 

 

Matt

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Hi Matt, this is very similar to what my car is doing. Have you sorted the starting problem out yet. I have not had time to get to the bottom of what's causing my problem and keep carrying out the same starting procedure that gets it started - pressing the fuel priming button and allowing the glowplugs 2 tries before turning the key fully clockwise. I also keep the Battery on trickle charge. I'll get round to fixing it when I've had my kitchen fitted - soon I hope.  Thanks for the video clip.

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Hi Alan, I haven't sorted it out yet. It is consistently slow to start (5 turns of the starter motor + heater plug time of 3 seconds) but it always starts. So do you pop the bonnet and press the fuel priming button every time you start the car?

 

Matt

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