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Mr Aitch

First Hybrid and Disappointed.

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I picked up my new Yaris Hybrid on 30/11/2019 and I am disappointed with the switch to hybrid.

My previous car was a 1.33 Yaris Icon 2016 and the fuel consumption so far after 600 miles is worse on the hybrid for all journey types.

The dealer predicted an improvement of between 10 and 15mpg for the hybrid, but it is 2-3 mpg worse. Is this a common occurrence.

Also I have had some strange happenings with the computer displays.  The energy monitor display sometimes shows the car engine to not be running when it clearly is.  The road sign assist has always read signs in mph up until today when I noticed the 20mph sign was red when I was doing 15. It only reverted to white below 20km/h. All other displays are still in imperial and no settings have been changed.

Finally the car mists up badly inside. I am shocked by this on a new car.

This is my 8th Toyota and I have never had an issue before. How have other drivers got on with the Yaris Hybrid?

 

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The fuel consumption falls dramatically in winter when the cabin heater is used a lot and the petrol engine runs to provide that heating and to keep itself warm too.

As for the misting, make sure you don't have the air recirculating for too long and use the air conditioning to dry the air, that actually has very little effect on consumption, having the heater too high certainly does.

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What mpg's are you getting? Both old and new Yaris. 

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Are you looking at the "real time" mpg or "overall" mpg ?

Yesterday on a drive back from the North Lakes in Cumbria my realtime mpg in the trusty Yaris Excel hybrid dropped as low as 17mpg  on the A66, but overall was 57.8mpg, about right for this time of year.

To clear your windscreen, from cold turn the temperature right down so the aircon is chilling,  and blasting on the windscreen, about 1 to 2 minutes later its crystal clear, then set your cabin temp. Works every time.

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Overall mpg. For example I drove from Manchester to Leicester on Christmas Day. In my 1.33 I always got over 50mpg on that run. My best was 52.4. In my hybrid I got 48.9. It was a very clear run so there wasn’t much town driving, mainly motorway, so it was running on the engine mostly. 
 

In my first week of having it I averaged 35mpg for my work commute. This is my main reason for getting it because it so stop/start. In my 1.33 I was getting over 40mpg usually and 38 was the worst recently.

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Hmm....is your Yaris mostly running in EV mode below 40mph, it should be if it's not labouring ..

Also, how does it run generally, mine goes like the clappers from a standing start upto 60mph , beyond that the acceleration is fairly mild.

Mebbe get some fuel additive to clean the injectors out.

Driving the hybrid way takes some time, if the expectation is a rapid go cart that does 60 mpg, it can be done , a good dab on the accelerator from a start to 30mph will see it sharpish out of the blocks, then back off on the accelerator and just lightly feather it, the occasional dab to maintain momentum around corners then back to EV mode.

Some of the roads around our neck of the country arent conducive to driving hybrid friendly, The M60, M56, the M62, the A34, the A6 through Hazel Grove, all  need that burst of speed to maintain momentum which kicks in the engine, I regularly drive the A54 over to Buxton - forget it, no chance of getting good MPGg in either direction, but one journey I do more than any is the run from Sandbach to Congleton to Macclesfield,  average speed is 40 mph, a lot of it on the flat, I do get over 60mpg on that route, do that route maybe 10 or 12 times a week, that's where I get my economy.

Stick with it, it's a very rewarding car once you get used to it. I'm keeping mine  for I hope at least 250,000 miles. 

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Thought I would chip in as I have had a Lexus IS 300h for 3 years (essentially the IS 300h and Yaris have the same powertrain just that the Lexus is a 2.5l engine and bigger electric motor/battery) and my wife bought a new Yaris Hybrid in September. Here are a few things when you move to a Hybrid that I found and my wife (who didn't drive my car) has been discovering - I have also driven her Yaris Hybrid so can add that experience too:

1. New cars take a while to reach best mpg - maybe 10k miles - especially a hybrid as the engine does less work so comparing with a well run in car for mpg can be misleading.

2. Hybrids need a different driving style to get the best out of them - if you Google driving a hybrid and read those that are driving any Toyota or Lexus (which have their own unique drivetrain with the e-cvt - lots of good info from Prius drivers which again is essentially the same as the Yaris powertrain) you will learn a lot from there.

3. I certainly don't do hypermiling as I often have to get to places quickly but I have altered my driving style - biggest one is thinking ahead and minimising sharp braking - so let the car slow on it's own or light braking to allow as much regeneration as possible - when accelerating though do that reasonably briskly letting the engine kick in and then back off (lift off the accelerator) and if everything is up to temperature and speed below about 45 mph the EV mode will come in and then feather the throttle lightly to maintain speed.

4. The throttle and brakes on hybrids are sensitive - to start and get used to the style of driving try Eco mode which makes the throttle less sensitive to inputs until you start to get the feel for when EV mode activates and deactivates. Lightly use the brakes as much as possible - the mechanical brakes don't work until the power meter bottoms out in the regen zone - at lower speeds you can drive for many miles and never use mechanical brakes just regen which is then storing energy for the next time you pick up speed again.

5. Best mpg is usually on open A/B roads - constant speed between 40mph and 60mph - I can see 60mpg in my Lexus and close to 70mpg in the Yaris (that was in the warmer weather). In overall mixed (town/country/motorway) driving 15,000 miles per annum my overall 3 year average in the Lexus is around 48mpg - I would expect the Yaris in the same driving conditions will be low to mid 50's - improving further if the mix of driving is less fast motorway and more urban/A/B road.

6. Journeys on long empty motorways don't really benefit so much from the hybrid - however on my Lexus I will reliably see 50 - 54 mpg in these conditions (making fast progress still) - we haven't tried the Yaris for long motorway runs yet but would expect it to be similar to the Lexus. However, the real gain of the hybrid on motorways is that in stop start traffic and roadworks (so long as you drive smoothly) the mpg will be maintained or even improve whereas on a normal engine car it will start to really drop.

7. Winter/cold weather (plus of course wipers/lights etc.) impacts mpg by about 10% - even more so if you are doing short journeys as the engine has to be working at the beginning of the journey and stay on more simply to reach and maintain its working temperature and heat the cabin.

8. With the Yaris Hybrid you have climate control - more than simply air con - so leave it set to Auto all the time and simply set the temperature - this will ensure the optimum conditions for keeping the temperature (warm or cold) and also keeping condensation down to a minimum - in wet conditions best to keep the air recirculation off (so draw air from the outside). Set to windscreen initially if needed to defrost and clear any early morning misting and then set back to Auto once that has gone.

9. On the speed sign recognition I have found the Yaris pretty good at this - probably around 90% correct - better than earlier versions I had tried a couple of years ago. It does sound like yours has a setting wrong somewhere though. On the energy monitor display it can lag a bit in displaying what is happening - I see this on my Lexus too from time to time. Best not to take too much notice of this - after a while you will get bored of watching it anyway though it is useful at the outset to get an idea of what is happening.

10. Give yourself time to settle into a hybrid driving style and then after 12 months compare your average fuel consumption which will have averaged over hot and cold weather and also your driving technique will have adjusted to make the most of the hybrid powertrain. Above all enjoy the car - the serenity of the electric traction, especially in urban and stop start driving makes it a very relaxing driving experience.

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Driving a hybrid is a lot different to a standard manual/auto, was your previous car a manual ? As for the sign warning make sure its set correctly on the touch2

As above, you need to learn how to drive a hybrid, if you are used to a manual, coasting down hill and up to junctions can feel a bit unusual avoid heavy braking and hard acceleration, around town i use no more than 20% throttle 

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That was an interesting read 😊

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Had mine nearly a year and it does help as you get used to driving it but at the moment on short trips around 47mpg which compared to my old Yaris 1.5 manual is about the same! but is winter time with heater on more and batteries are better in warmer conditions, summer time it was up to around 51mpg on short trips which is better just shame winter levels are not great, for me it works more like a stop start system and my next Yaris will be a 1 litre as it will get the same MPG for mainly short trips to work without paying the extra for Hybrid. 

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Lots of people who get into a Hybrid for the first time struggle with MPG. There is a certain driving style that will get you the MPG you desire. I currently drive a Corolla Hybrid, in the summer I was getting 74 MPG, that has dropped to 68 MPG in the winter. Make sure your air direction is on fresh, air con on, the screen will clear very quickly. I have salesmen ask me how do I get such good MPG, they all think they can drive Hybrids, they can't, they want to drive it like a motoring Journo and wonder why the get poor results 

 

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As for the mist up mine does but leave the air con button on as you heat the car works a treat then switch off when screen clear. 

Edited by Eddie G
Spelling mistake.

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@martswain spot on about having normal heating on too high (with air con button off) stops EV mode kicking in as quickly. 

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To put mpg into context we have just been out in my wife's Yaris Hybrid with me driving (car was new in September and has done less than 1,000 miles) - from stone cold in the wet and dark, two up, lights and wipers on, air con on and heated rear screen on for some of the time we drove 10 miles, stayed an hour at the other end and drove the 10 miles back again. Driving normally to the speed limit on roads that were fairly quiet and a mix of 30mph through villages with stop start through traffic lights and then more open 40mph and some 60mph. The mpg for the round trip on the computer was just short of 55mpg which is what I would have expected for the conditions. A longer journey after everything had warmed up etc. in the same conditions I'm sure would have yielded quite a few more mpg. As for condensation there was some when we got back in the car after stopping for the hour with the cold rain on the glass and warm air in the car but after starting the car again with air con on, heated rear window on and airflow directed to windscreen it was all clear in a couple of minutes. Hope that helps with expectations. 

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Go onto You Tube a search for “how to get best mpg from a Yaris hybrid car” and you will get videos of driving tips. Simply type in “Yaris hybrid cars” you will get reviews, typically from journalist type reviews which can be very misleading cause most of them just want pedal to floor then slate the economy of the car - what do they expect?  When I was contemplating getting a hybrid (my first one was an Auris which the wife now drives) I spent hours on You Tube picking up driving techniques. Lots of videos were from USA so you have to remember the size of their gallon is different to UK. I find m-way driving is not really good for mpg, also the same re cruise control, I get better results using my right foot to control speed.
      The Yaris hybrid has a physically smaller Battery then say the Corolla and Prius due to restriction of vehicle size, so a Yaris is going to fall short of what a Corolla does mpg. 
     Even today, in cool temperatures, my Prius Gen4 I was doing 75.3 mpg, during the summer that would have probably been about 80mpg. Hybrid batteries do not like cold nor heat, typical of all batteries actually even AA/AAA.  Like has been said, if you have heaters, demisters, wipers, radio all on the mpg will take a hit.

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I accept what many are saying about driving style, but I have been driving carefully, with light throttle and gentle braking well in advance for many years since doing a defensive driving training course through my employer.

I have managed to master getting it to switch to EV mode at light throttle on the flat at up to 40mpg and am using ECO mode most of the time. I have seen a small improvement since my first week but still not getting what I was in my 1.33 manual.

In terms of what is powered on like lights, heated rear window etc. whatever is on is the same as I would have on in the 1.33. I put things on when needed. I am comparing like for like.

In respect of misting up, I haven’t used recirculate and frequently have to have the air con on. It is badly misted up when I get to it after it has been parked at work if it is wet outside. I have only ever had this problem before when the boot seal leaked on a mondeo and the carpet was wet. It can take 10 minutes to clear it enough to drive. When I get home I have to wipe the remaining moisture off. 

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An observation: the new engine might be a bit tight and, if so, the mpg should improve over time.

Even if the mpg ends up similar to the 1.33, consider the merits you now have: the stop/start system is the best you will ever get this side of an EV, it is a small automatic car, it is quiet and its performance off the mark is better than most cars. You basically have a car that drives like an EV, but is noisier under full power.

As mentioned, leave aircon on all the time, set it to auto and just dial the temp.

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I bought my new Yaris Hybrid in January 2019, the following is the MPG until recently. The figures are not computer generated but are the reliable full tank to full tank calculated.

First tank full = 45 mpg February short runs . 2nd fill = 52 mpg March short runs. 3rd fill = 54.8 mpg April long runs. 4th fill = 51.2 mpg May short runs. 5th fill = 58.46 mpg long runs May. 6th fill = 53.86 mpg June short runs. 7th fill = 64.9 mpg long runs June. 8th fill = 57.05 mpg short runs July. 9th fill = 58.77 mpg three passengers long run July. 10th fill = 52.03 mpg short runs September. 11th fill = 58.9 mpg short runs October. 12th fill = 47.7 mpg short runs November. Short runs equates to mostly town driving. As you can see a dramatic drop in mpg when the weather turned cold in Nov, and in January and Feb.

So the above are the best mpg I could extract from my new Yaris Hybrid and I was using all the care and tricks I possibly could use.

The current mileage is 4,500 approximately. 

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Sounds spot on Bernard, have had mine up to 54-57 on a real long summer run out otherwise short runs and winter very much like yours, could do with a better Battery possible the next Gen Yaris out next year will have one? but was expected a tad better will be going for a 1 litre Yaris next time unless new Yaris improves on the Battery. Current mileage on mine (A GR Sport but driven smooth and not like am in a race) is 5600 approx. 

Edited by Eddie G
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The new WLTP for the Yaris Hybrid is 56.4 mpg.

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30 minutes ago, Eddie G said:

@wharfhouse Lithium-ion battery on next Gen Yaris from looks of it, a good idea 😁👍

The 56.4mpg is for the current Yaris so next one will be better. Not so much from the Battery but other improvements in the drive train. I had a Lexus UX for the day a week ago which has the next 4th gen drive train and although still NiMH Battery the hybrid system was noticeably better than my IS 300h 3rd gen drive train. The new Yaris will I believe have this 4th gen drive train. 

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Mine is a 2016 just over 27K on the clock, 62mpg but when the temp dropped off, so did the mpg to around 52-56mpg, 90-95% town driving with an average speed of 13-16 mph

All the cells in the pack read the same if not within 1%

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I got my 2016 Yaris Hybrid in late October 2019 and have driven it some 3,000 miles since. I also was a little bit disappointed when I did some calculations after the first tank stops.

The previous owner used the car for commuting to work, the dealer said this guy drove the car exactly the same route every day. When I got it, the trip computer was not reset to zero, so obviously his average mileage was 5.1 liter per 100 km (55.4 mpg UK), calculated over thousands of miles. After my first tank refill I calculated my mileage at 5.7 liter per 100 km (49.6 mpg) which I found quite disappointing. My next tank refill gave me 5.2 liter (54.3 mpg). One one hand, this is a whooping 35 percent less than my previous car, a Citroen C3 Pluriel with SensoDrive gearbox and 1.6 liter 109 hp engine. On the other hand, this is about 50 percent more than the rating for the old NEDC test cycle.

German automobile club ADAC has tested the car and has reported a combined mileage of 4.8 liter per 100 km (58.85 mpg), and I think that this is a reasonable figure for everyday use and for a driving style which cares for the environment without requiring unreasonable stunts (see: hypermiling, pulse and glide).

Right now, I am monitoring the mileage of my car quite closely, and I got results ranging from 4.6 liter (61.4 mpg) up to 7.8 liter (36.2 mpg). The first, low fuel consumption was the result of approx. 25 miles in calm city traffic in Hamburg. The second, high consumption was rather high speed Autobahn chasing with speeds up to 105 mph and the cruise control set to values between 85 and 95 mph.

From what I have found out myself and from what others tell me, there seem to be several factors which increase the fuel consumption:

1. cold starts in cold weather: When the car is cold, the engine will run on a high idle speed even if the car does not move. This is for warming up the catalytic converter and the engine coolant. When I got my best mileage figure, I had been on the Autobahn before, the engine was warm. Then I stopped at a petrol station, refilled my tank and reset the trip computer. Then the car went through heavy city traffic, but without having to heat up the engine. People who make a sport out of saving fuel, have another trick: When the engine is cold, they switch off the heating system entirely during the warm up period and rely on the heated seats instead;-)

2. Speeding: The recommended top speed on the German Autobahn is 130 kph (81 mph). I think this is pretty fast for a Yaris Hybrid driver on a fuel saving mission. If you are patient enough to stick with 110 kph (68 mph), your fuel consumption probably will drop by 25 percent. It seems to me that at high speeds the Yaris Hybrid is not more fuel efficient than other petrol powered cars of the same size. A Turbodiesel car may even do better.

3. Using cruise control: People who want to reduce their fuel consumption in a hybrid car should try to make use of the momentum of the car. It seems to save fuel when you accelerate the car firmly until the desired cruising speed, then let it coast a while, then accelerate again... Let the car roll when the road goes downhill and accelerate when it goes up again. And many Toyota Hybrid drivers say that the cruise control is not smart enough to do this. You can hear that. When you drive with cruise control, even slightly ascending roads immediately drive up the engine revs. This costs fuel.

4. Driving in wet conditions with winter tires. I expect a lower fuel consumption in the summer time.

Right now, my personal fuel consumption is slightly higher than initially expected. But I think that it is unfair to judge a Hybrid car only on its fuel consumption. You may not forget that the Yaris features such nice goodies as a seamless transmission, an electric mode for silent operation and a bulletproof drivetrain without clutch, torque converter, alternator or starter.

The last weeks I travelled Germany from south to north and back. I drove hours using the cruise control, and maybe I was turning the heating too high, because I like it warm. Maybe this cost me fuel worth 10 Euros. Okay, so be it;-)


Best regards from Bavaria
Frank

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