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Auto or Manual ? New car purchase..


rich146
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Hi All

Im sure this has been brought up a number of times but not sure whether to go for Auto or Manual transmission. Im used to a normal full Auto (DSG) and not sure if I will be disappointed expecting a similar experience with the Aygo Auto?

Also wondering about resale value and whether auto is less or more popular being fewer around.

Manual might be a better option to keep mechanics simple perhaps?

 

Your thoughts would be appreciated, thanks 

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Go test drive the auto and see what you think of it, it's not everybody's cup of tea.

They also seem to require clutch replacement more often than manual boxes.

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Manual, if interested in automatic best to look at Yaris hybrid, Toyota hybrids has the best automatic transmission of all cars. 👍

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Automatic.  Manual is so last century.  In ten years time you won't be able to buy a new car with a manual gearbox, in fact as we go fully electric cars won't even have a gearbox.

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6 minutes ago, martswain said:

@Trewithy, the CVT is fine in a Yaris or Corolla, but the robot gearbox and clutch in the Aygo is another matter !

 

I guess you haven't tried one, LOL.

Sorry, I was thinking of a normal automatic I didn't know that the Aygo was different.  Some years ago I hired a Corsa with an automated manual gearbox; it was awful, if the Aygo has a similar gearbox then give it a miss.

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The Aygo automatic box is a standard gearbox and clutch but with compuyer actuated arms changing gear ionstead of you. It appears they are like Marmite....... you love or hate. The drivers who hate are probably the ones that have had problems. 

As Tony said, if you look at a Toyota hybrid non of them have a manual box and the e-cvt boxes are ulta reliable. Thats the wqay to go,

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I’ve been driving manual in excess of fifty years and four years ago I bought the mark 3 Yaris Hybrid which has the cvt transmission, and I wouldn’t buy any car now that didn’t have an automatic transmission. I would never buy a stick shift ever again. I have no experience with the Argo semi automatic gearbox, but from reading owners experiences on this forum I would avoid them like a plague. The Yaris I’m driving is an exceptional driving experience and has a great reputation for reliability. So you pays your money and you takes your choice.

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There are many automatic transmission types makes models but only few are good and reliable, Toyota has the best and unique auto transmission in their hybrids and no other manufacturer has something similar. That transmission actually makes these hybrids the best of all plus the engine too. Most other types of cvt transmission dual clutch transmission are problematic in a long run including the automated manual like Aygo has. I tried aygo manual two years ago and enjoyed every second driving it, I actually like to drive manuals but for fun only not every day and for work. Manuals are kind of old school already. 👍

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Thanks all. Well I’m used to driving a very sophisticated DSG so maybe I’ll give the auto a miss but will definitely test drive it first if anything out of curiosity 

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I'd go manual as I have a general dislike of automatic gearboxes, the exceptions being hybrids and EV's, since technically they don't have gearboxes!

The worst are semi-auto boxes like the MMT, and to a lessor extent DSG - Proprietary, expensive to repair, and they have too many of the disadvantages of a manual and automatic and not enough of the advantages.

The Aygo is a tricky one; I'd never get an MMT-equipped one, but I never really got on with the manual either - Had one as a loaner while my D4D was being fixed and found the biting point far too high and hard to feel compared to my Yaris, which was just better in every way!

Now I've gotten used to my Mk4 Hybrid so I worry all those years of developing my clutch finesse and skill training will atrophy :sad:

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52 minutes ago, Cyker said:

I'd go manual as I have a general dislike of automatic gearboxes, the exceptions being hybrids and EV's, since technically they don't have gearboxes!

The worst are semi-auto boxes like the MMT, and to a lessor extent DSG - Proprietary, expensive to repair, and they have too many of the disadvantages of a manual and automatic and not enough of the advantages.

The Aygo is a tricky one; I'd never get an MMT-equipped one, but I never really got on with the manual either - Had one as a loaner while my D4D was being fixed and found the biting point far too high and hard to feel compared to my Yaris, which was just better in every way!

Now I've gotten used to my Mk4 Hybrid so I worry all those years of developing my clutch finesse and skill training will atrophy :sad:

The last sentence I will take it as a joke 😊👍 once you had mastered the clutch skills they stay for life 🏎✌️

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I've never owned a VAG group car so I've never had to cope with DSG problems but I've driven a lot of hire cars with one in and as an auto box it's a really good one.

You can't directly compare the Toyota ecvt box to a regular auto though.  The cvt box does exactly what it needs to do to allow the engine and electric motor to work together.

My daughter is 17 next year and she's wondering wether to learn just auto but we talked about it and manuals will still be around for a long time.  If you have a manual licence you can drive an auto but not vice versa and like riding a bike, once you've got a bit of manual driving under your belt you won't forget it.

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To avoid confusion to potential owners I do wish people wouldn't discuss CVT or DSG gearboxes in the context of the Aygo - it doesn't have either of those as it's an automated manual using the same gearbox as a manual Aygo but with an ECU controlling a clutch actuator and a gear selector mechanism.

Comparing those different types of "automatic" gearboxes really isn't helpful IMHO for someone wanting to buy an Aygo.

I owned a manual C1 (Aygo in disguise) for 10 years having to have the clutch replaced after 30,000 miles (it was the old 180mm clutch not the newer 190mm one) and sold that for an x-shift Aygo (automated manual) in October 2020. I drive it almost exclusively in M (manual) mode using the paddles to change gear because the ECU software seems to like being in too low a gear much of the time.

As said above, try one before you decide whether to go manual or x-shift - and make up your own mind whether you like it and can live with it.

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I am sure that others have allready told you but I will repeat it any how. Aygo MMT auto is a big no, no, no. MMT is a problem waiting to happen. We have been there, seen that, done that and regreted it every bit.  Any other Toyota with CVT auto is fine. Toyota CVT s are usually very reliable and good, specially the newer ones. The older ones tended to be a bit noisy, whining noise. Our 2015 auris cvt is quiet.

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Most of the people I've seen on this forum who don't have much trouble with the MMT tend to use it in manual mode, but I always thought why would you buy an automatic gearbox to use it in manual mode!? I wonder if it is because the car is shifting too early, as you say, when in auto mode, causing the clutch to drag and wear faster?

And yeah, always better to learn Manual - You will learn to get a feel for how the power flows through the transmission in a way that I doubt you'd get with an automatic; I feel so abstracted from the power train of automatics, even in my Mk4 - It's fortunate that Toyota have done a good job of it so I feel reasonably confidant that I can just let the car get on with it - It's not a confidence I feel in most automatics!

As for the clutch thing, wasn't joking - I already suspect I'd have trouble hill starting a gutless manual car without frying the clutch now and it's only been half a year! Probably come back after a bit of practice, but with the way things are going it'll be a moot point soon anyway: I think the next generation will be the last who will be able to get manual licences as driving schools are forced to switch to electric and gearboxes will be a thing of the past!

 

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30 minutes ago, Cyker said:

Most of the people I've seen on this forum who don't have much trouble with the MMT tend to use it in manual mode, but I always thought why would you buy an automatic gearbox to use it in manual mode!? I wonder if it is because the car is shifting too early, as you say, when in auto mode, causing the clutch to drag and wear faster?

There are people around (e.g: my cousin) who wants to Up-Shift and Down-Shift manually but too lazy to press the clutch.

Anyway, for me, it is definitely Manual.  More control, better fuel economy and easier to replace the clutch.

And if I was to think about Automatic, it will definitely be hybrid.  The latest No Transmission version takes the CVT out of the equation.   To be fair, Toyota's CVT has been fairly reliable, but it will be even better without it.

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1 hour ago, Cyker said:

And yeah, always better to learn Manual - You will learn to get a feel for how the power flows through the transmission in a way that I doubt you'd get with an automatic;

100% agree, pass the test getting a manual licence then you can drive manual or auto but pass the test on an auto and you can't drive a manual.

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On 9/4/2021 at 9:03 AM, PetrolDave said:

To avoid confusion to potential owners I do wish people wouldn't discuss CVT or DSG gearboxes in the context of the Aygo - it doesn't have either of those as it's an automated manual using the same gearbox as a manual Aygo but with an ECU controlling a clutch actuator and a gear selector mechanism.

Comparing those different types of "automatic" gearboxes really isn't helpful IMHO for someone wanting to buy an Aygo.

I owned a manual C1 (Aygo in disguise) for 10 years having to have the clutch replaced after 30,000 miles (it was the old 180mm clutch not the newer 190mm one) and sold that for an x-shift Aygo (automated manual) in October 2020. I drive it almost exclusively in M (manual) mode using the paddles to change gear because the ECU software seems to like being in too low a gear much of the time.

As said above, try one before you decide whether to go manual or x-shift - and make up your own mind whether you like it and can live with it.

Would you say even with the paddles in manual mode are better to use than the stick and clutch? Discounts at the moment allow for auto upgrade just short of £500. It looks residual values are higher with auto boxes which doesn't make sense if its so poor ?

 

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Personally, no.

Nothing beats the control of a well coordinated human brain and feet, especially when parking.

I bought a manual after trying the "auto"

Try both before you splash the cash !

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I passed in a manual 21 years ago, but the last 13 years have driven an auto. All old school Volvo 240/940 models with the AW70/71 Autobox. Happy with the gearbox and no issues in 90,000 miles with me. 1989 240 GLT petrol Auto sold with 234,000miles. and current 96 940 petrol auto 206,000miles.

Have a 2015 auris Hybrid estate and the ECVT is fine. Revs a bit noisy when booting it but nice and quiet once up to speed. Love the quietness and economy. Practical as had Volvo estates for the last 15 years.

Drove a manual 1.5 yaris on a 2020 reg and didn't like the engine or gearbox. Didn't feel that slick and engine noisy when revved. Much prefer the Hybrid drivetrain. Liked the Yaris interior space. As a city car a great choice, but hybrid.

Had a few manual hire/courtesy cars and nicest to drive have been a Skoda superb, Renault Fluence, Alfa Julietta. All hire cars, mostly hired in Ireland. Favourite for economy and comfort was the Renault Fluence. Very comfy and good on fuel as all diesel. Wouldn't own a Renault though.

James.👍

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53 minutes ago, Auris James said:

I passed in a manual 21 years ago, but the last 13 years have driven an auto. All old school Volvo 240/940 models with the AW70/71 Autobox. Happy with the gearbox and no issues in 90,000 miles with me. 1989 240 GLT petrol Auto sold with 234,000miles. and current 96 940 petrol auto 206,000miles.

Have a 2015 auris Hybrid estate and the ECVT is fine. Revs a bit noisy when booting it but nice and quiet once up to speed. Love the quietness and economy. Practical as had Volvo estates for the last 15 years.

Drove a manual 1.5 yaris on a 2020 reg and didn't like the engine or gearbox. Didn't feel that slick and engine noisy when revved. Much prefer the Hybrid drivetrain. Liked the Yaris interior space. As a city car a great choice, but hybrid.

Had a few manual hire/courtesy cars and nicest to drive have been a Skoda superb, Renault Fluence, Alfa Julietta. All hire cars, mostly hired in Ireland. Favourite for economy and comfort was the Renault Fluence. Very comfy and good on fuel as all diesel. Wouldn't own a Renault though.

James.👍

But not an Aygo ?

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1 hour ago, martswain said:

Personally, no.

Nothing beats the control of a well coordinated human brain and feet, especially when parking.

I bought a manual after trying the "auto"

Try both before you splash the cash !

Ok cheers. That helps. Will indeed try both. cheers

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1 hour ago, martswain said:

Nothing beats the control of a well coordinated human brain and feet, especially when parking.

Actually this leads to what driving you need to do.

One scenario might be reverse out of a drive, drive to work, park nose in, back out, drive home.  Skill or no skill but manual or auto would suit.

Another might be regular long distance driving and cruising in top gear.  Again either would suit.

But what converted me was driving on the A2 out of London in a Focus.  Once I had cleared the city I had to stop and give my left leg a rest.  My previous motoring had been much like a drive to work with few gear changes.  If your driving involves dozens of clutch operations for mile after mile go automatic.  Add ACC and it takes all the drudgery out of a commute.

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