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Toyota Auris won't drive up hill in second gear.


charlesmctegart
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hi there,

I have bought a Toyota Auris  2009 1.3 dual vvti. It has 99000 miles on the clock. On the straight and narrow it goes ok with a little throttle lag. Starting on a hill and moving off is an impossibility !  It will move off in 1st ok then as soon as you  select 2nd gear it just goes flat and comes to a stop. You need to de clutch and  select 1st gear whilst revving the engine, to move off !  It is showing no obd 2 fault codes and I have worked my way through electronic testing of the throttle, maf  and mat. sensors, cleaned the  EGR valve, cleaned the vvti selector valves, and it still will not drive up a hill unless you get up to 70mph before you hit the slope!

Any ideas of what is going on here, ....   because it functions well on a level road. 😟

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Sounds like a slipping clutch, on the flat try and pull away in 3rd, if the car stalls it's not the clutch, if the engine will rev and not move the clutch has gone

Any strange sounds ? Are the driveshafts ok ??

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Hi Charles and welcome to TOC.

I assume you not carrying half a ton of bricks in the back!  How steep and how long are these hills.? I see you are from Cornwall and there can be some seriously steep hills. As you get to the hill are you changing to a lower gear as the engine revs start to drop.? And the probably drop a gear again depending on the steepness and length of the hill.          
What was your previous car, was it petrol or diesel, and what size engine? You now got a 1.3 litre petrol, and you have to live with and manage the torque it produces. 

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When you select 2nd gear after moving off and let the clutch out what sort of revs are you seeing? I have the 1.33L and you do need to give it plenty of revs if the conditions demand it. If your reaching say 3 or 4k in 1st on a hill start and then smartly change to 2nd it should pull away just fine. If it doesn't then it does sound like something is amiss or the 'hill' is more like a wall. If you are below 2 to 2.5k in second and the hill is steep then it won't pick up from that. Don't be afraid to use all the rev range if needed.

 

 

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If it's all revs and no go then sounds like a clutch issue as suggested.

If, on the other hand, the engine is generally very reluctant to rev up, even in neutral, consider the possibility of a restricted exhaust. Catalytic converters can block up, especially if there's been a misfire or  overfuelling problem somewhere in the cars history.

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How long you had it?, if very recent it Maybe worth trying a hard Battery reset just before your hill climb, it will then adapt to your driving demands rather than relying on previous drivers driving style

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I vote for the "needs a new clutch" theory!

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I think what OP is trying to say it works fine in 1st, but in 2nd car behaves differently, and stalls, more or less.

Considering the work done, i'd say he should recognize a worn out clutch already.

Could be the car is starving for gas. Considering the Auris has filter only in the tank, if the tank has some crud in it, or maybe going uphill positions some dirt in the filter in such way that it's being starved for fuel.

Does the amount of petrol in the car change situation in some way? 

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If it was fuel starvation the car would cough and splutter, and the CEL would likely come on - I've experienced a clogged diesel filter in my old Mk1 D4D and the car would splutter and go into limp mode under hard acceleration.

I reckon it is the clutch as when my dad's old Corolla Verso 2.0D4D's clutch started wearing out the car would drive fine but if you gave it any beans the engine would rev up like a CVT but the car wouldn't accelerate any faster. He never noticed because he drives very gently, but because I drive like a hooligan I noticed it immediately :laugh: 

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The original poster visited the forum 7 hours ago, so he could have read up to the last but one reply ie furtula’s reply. It’s frustrating I find that people will put forward a problem then either don’t come back or do come back but don’t respond in any way.

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Thank you for  your comments.

The clutch is fine. I am thinking fuel flow reduced by crud or blocked filter. Or flagging throttle body not quite doing what it should in terms of position sensor or throttle  butterfly motor.

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Sorry for the tardy reply but I have been out all day 

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21 minutes ago, charlesmctegart said:

Sorry for the tardy reply but I have been out all day 

 No offence meant, sometimes I do it to get a reaction. 😎
 

How much fuel do you normally have in the tank? If the answer is “usually not much”, why not put a full tank in then top up after you done say 150 miles, so it never goes low.

if you suspect fuel filter clogged, why would it be ok on the flat.

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Not a clogged filter but a "reduced flow" which works until you make a larger demand for fuel. Or the fuel pump worn out. 

I was looking for someone to say " the same thing happened to me and "this" cured it."

  

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Oh so when you say 'it goes flat' you meant the engine looses all power! I can see why you think it may be a fuel starvation issue.

Unless you suspect bad fuel, I would try cleaning the MAF sensor first as that's often a culprit for reduced power - A dirty MAF can't sense higher air flow and doesn't tell the ECU to put more fuel in so the engine ends up running lean.

If you want to DIY, it'll be attached to the intake by a few screws, and is a plug with an electrical connector on the outside, and what looks like a little piece of amber rice on the end of two wires in it on the bit that goes into the intake - Some electrical switch cleaner at a distance should clean it - Spray it gently all over and let it dry before reinstalling. Don't blast it up close as it's quite delicate and you might break it! Some people use carb cleaner but that's a bit harsh and can leave residue so I prefer to recommend some proper electrical switch cleaner as that's designed not to leave any residue.

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Thanks for your reply

 

Done the MAF and tested it with a multi meter. Its functioning. as is the throttle body.  

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2 hours ago, charlesmctegart said:

Thanks for your reply

 

Done the MAF and tested it with a multi meter. Its functioning. as is the throttle body.  

So basically only loosing power when under load and you have checked air flow as described, now you will need to check fuel supply and exhaust. If a fuel filter is clogged to the point that may reduce fuel delivery it will eventually splutter when going uphill but not to loose power completely, if it’s a fuel pump going bad usually this comes along with difficult engine starts. Exhaust blockage is also a think as been noted on earlier posts, you will need to look at these two possibilities. Perhaps you may try some fuel additives first to see if there is any positive change. Good luck 

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Yes,

When recovering from a near stall on a hill , I de-clutch and press the accelerator  the revs rise to a big number and I slip the clutch and move off in 1st gear.  So The car will deliver high revs given the chance . That seems to work against the fuel starvation and blocked exhaust thoughts I am having. You de-clutch to get the revs to rise up ?

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1 hour ago, charlesmctegart said:

Yes,

When recovering from a near stall on a hill , I de-clutch and press the accelerator  the revs rise to a big number and I slip the clutch and move off in 1st gear.  So The car will deliver high revs given the chance . That seems to work against the fuel starvation and blocked exhaust thoughts I am having. You de-clutch to get the revs to rise up ?

Actually not always fuel starvation will cause problems when you rev the engine without load but will cause poor performance when under load and this is happening exactly in your case, second gear add extra load to the engine while first gear is multiplied at different gear ratio  and the engine is somewhat unloaded similar to revving up at idle. You may try wynns catalytic converter and lambda sensor cleaner in max 30ltr of fuel and take the car for a 30-40 min continuous motorway drive, few harder accelerations from 40-70mph and some drive at lower gear with higher rpm. This thing helped me few times on different cars with issues with poor performance or pulsating when under load at fast acceleration, it may help you too, then you can use injector cleaner or after a while repeat with the same additive if there are any positive results, also you can try premium fuel like 99 octane E5, my car is a hybrid but done all above recently and the car drives like new. 👍https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Wynns-Catalytic-Convertor-Lambda-Cleaner-325ml-Plus-FREE-Delivery-/254676772681?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m2548.l6249&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0

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I had a similar problem on a 2006 2.0 petrol Mazda 6 (electronic throttle body) some years back.  But I had no definite conclusion as to the fix.  The 'flat spot', once it started, was there all the time and slowly got worse.

The previous day, I had filled the car up at the local large, busy petrol station.  I noticed that a tanker was doing a routine fuel delivery at the same time.  Some people suggest that fuel deliveries can disturb the crud that accumulates in the underground fuel tanks at garages, and that this can be delivered to your fuel tank.  I had never seen this problem myself.

The next day I had a 160 mile trip to do.  At around half way, the car started to present the symptoms you describe, just without the going-up-hill bit being very evident.

I got the car home, but the point at which the car hit the 'flat spot' got slower and slower as the journey progressed.  By the time I got back it would barely reach 30 mph.  I complained to the petrol station about the car's problem, but they denied all knowledge, and said there fuel handling procedures met the relevant British Standards.  Whatever.

The next day, I removed the back seat cushions and removed the in-tank petrol gauge and pick-up filter, which was a thoroughly unpleasant and potentially dangerous job.  I dismantled the unit as much as I could when it was away the car, but found no muck at all,  or any obvious problems.  The filter on that car was a simple, and fairly crude, nylon mesh.

When I reassembled everything the problem had completely disappeared, and didn't come back while I had the car (5 months?)

Nothing else on the car was disturbed, and there were no warning lamps showing at any time.  

HTH

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So basically, get the tank maybe 20% full, and go to some rural dirt road with plenty of holes so the gasoline swooshes around, cleaning the filter 🙂

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Is it possible the fuel filter could develop an “invisible (to the eye) membrane” acting as a blockage.  I know it can happen in carpet cleaning machine, the filter in the clean water tank can develop this invisible membrane causing a block. A good slosh around could work.

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If the car will do 70mph on the flat, it's not fuel issue, a bad cat the engine wouldn't rev and it would only do 30mph

2 hours ago, charlesmctegart said:

Yes,

When recovering from a near stall on a hill , I de-clutch and press the accelerator  the revs rise to a big number and I slip the clutch and move off in 1st gear.  So The car will deliver high revs given the chance

It's a drivetrain problem, a clutch, pressure plate issue or slave, striped splines on one of the drive shafts

The revs will rise, but it will not move or will move slowly if the clutch is slipping under load, please test the clutch as stated above or take it to a garage to diagnose the issue

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I have had a similar problem, took main dealer months to fix who tried replacing almost everything in turn to no avail. It ended up being duff valve timing after a cam belt change. I realise yours is a chain, but could someone have tinkered with that? 

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Thanks for your input. ...............Food for thought !!

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