Code 21! = £300 Argggghh!

[Beardie]

It's from a 1.6 lean burn. 89463-20070 Denso. 93 model.

[dgo_carina]

Toyota say I need an Oxygen Sensor part no. is 889463 - 29055.

But i found this image listing toyota oxygen sensors (sites all in russian tho')

http://alflash.narod.ru/Learn/CarinaE/CarinaE.gif

Yours sensor is listed (89463-20070) but the nearest sensor to my part no. is 29045.

So the sensors seem different for the 93 and 95 years.

I'm going to ring Toyota direct and see if the part no.quoted is typo or really is a "055". My quote from Toyota says £276.88 + VAT.

That keeps reminding me of why I am looking for a 2nd hand oxygen sensor.

thanks

D

[Beardie]

No probs, keep looking. I have replaced sensors on other Carina E's and have'nt really noticed the difference between a lean burn one and a bog standard 4A-Fe one. they both appear to work. My current 93 model is running off a 98 Avensis spec sensor...

[dgo_carina]

So do you think I should whack in a close match Oxygen sensor and see?

The only trouble is the cost of these 2nd hand sensors versus the risk if they don't "work". Sadly despite the mentions in this post no-ones offered me 1) the exact type and 2) a sensible price - considering compatibility gamble. As time drags on I am more likely to gamble now on a cheap sensor just to get the Dash's error light out.

I am also concerned re: why Toyota says it's failed yet the Carina passed all its MOT emissions. Is my Learn Burn just so good that even a duff Oxy. sensor couldn't stop it passing OR was it a dodgy MOT test?

thanks

Beardie for your patience.

David

[dgo_carina]

More Toyota part news:

Dear beardie,

I seem to have some evidence that putting a variety of sensors in the Carina 1.6 4afe would do no major harm.

Oxygensensors have a Catalog part # Walkers 250-24151 which Replaces:

Toyota part no.s

89425-69045, 89463-29045, 89463-29055, 89465-12530, 89465-19575, 89465-20260, 89465-28130, 89465-29545, 89465-33040, 89465-34010, 89465-34030, 89465-35180, 89465-35210, 89465-35310, 89465-39435, 89465-39445, 89465-39446, 89465-39455, 89465-39475, 89465-39625, 89465-39775, 89465-60040, 89465-69045

Sadly yours is not on the list but now I seem to have more info to track a 2nd hand one down.

Apparently in the U.S.A the sensor was fitted on a 92-93 Celicia 1.6.

thanks

D

[cal]

Hello dgo_carina,

The reason for the sensor failing and yet passing the Mot is that, the ECU could be in 'emergency' mode. When one of the sensors fail and especially with the engine management light, the ECU will be in 'emergency' mode which it will run the engine OK, but the management will be in set parameters rather than variable parameters based on the feed back from other sensors, i.e. the ignition timing will not move as much etc. This is to protect the engine and for this reason your car may have passed the Mot.

However, as you know the car is no way close to normal operation, thus you should have the sensor replaced soon.

I am sorry that I cannot be of any help on finding the source for the sensor but wishing you best of luck.

[dgo_carina]

Thanks caldina for helping explain my MOT success,

I suppose that's the good thing about the Lean Burn 1600 engine. Even when in "emergency" mode it's doing OK!

Now back to getting that oxygen sensor.

Happy Motoring!

dgo_carina

[Beardie]

dgo

For your info. My C E is displaying my ECU light. I'm not worried. Cos I'm running well advanced timing to get more mpg from my LPG system.

The reasons are many, lean mixture, rich mixture, injectors too slow to react, sensors. The main thing is that the fault may not be active all the time. It onlt takes one blip outside of operating range to trigger the light.

[dgo_carina]

Dear All Carina Owners,

SUCCESS : Toyota Oxygen Sensor fitted from 1600cc K plate 4afe engine (115k miles ) into my trusty (?) N reg Carina Lean Burn.

25 squid for 2nd hand sensor. At that price I thought it was worth the risk, The Lambda sensor did looked slightly different: the wires were the right colours and the fixings were the same.. SO FAR NO engine warning light (ECU) ..

thanks to all those for the advice.. Thanks to the Carina Haynes manual... you read it & u get to tell the mechanic important stuff!

David :)

[noyvirt]

Hello,

Does anybody knows the difference between:89463-29045 and 89463-20060? Are they the same?

[noyvirt]

Beardie,

What timing do you use for your lpg carina?

[Nix]

If you're worried about buying a faulty sensor then a tester is £15 on e-bay. Much less than the cost of buying a dodgy one!

However, I STILL can't find a sensor for my 1.8 CarinaE & the fixing nut has turned to butter so I'm having fun trying to get the old one out. :ffs:

Has anyone tried getting through the MOT without fixing the sensor?

[gaz_D]

I'm interested to know if the engine management light on the dashboard mght come on because the Battery was disconnected? I've read that the oxygen sensor will read as faulty if its power supply has been disconnected.

Anyone have any thoughts on this please??

Cheers,

Gaz

[dbaker]

Hello,

I hope you still read your mail, as I know the issue you had with your carina E lambda sensor back in 2003 is the same as I have now.

I was interested because you mentioned you were tempted to try a universal sensor. Did you try one? and if so what happened?

My thinking is as follows:

The toyota lambda sensor used on the carina e lean burn is a standard zirconia sensor (oscillating between 0.1 and 0.9V) Its NOT a wde band type.

The only difference is the resistance of the heater being 2.5 ohm or so in the carina vs 4-5ohm in the universal one.

I have been informed that a universal one will cause the engine management light to come on and cause 'possible erratic running'. But my thoughts are that after the 15mins it takes for the universal heater to reach temp (compared to the minute or so in the lean burn one) the engine will run fine. IF (which is possible) that by detecting the difference in heater resistance causes the ECU to run in 'rich' mode, thereby ignoring the lambda sensor- then maybe a 12V feed can be supplied to a universal sensor fitted in the downpipe (from the loom) and the 2 wire feed to the lambda sensor heater can be 'tricked' simply with a homemade 2.5 Ohm coil of fuse wire.

Dunno. whats your experience

Graham

[ma109]

I'm interested to know if the engine management light on the dashboard mght come on because the battery was disconnected? I've read that the oxygen sensor will read as faulty if its power supply has been disconnected.

Anyone have any thoughts on this please??

Cheers,

Gaz

Gaz, I've had to replace my lambda sensor twice, both times immediately after the Battery went flat. I questioned this with my mechanic (i.e. was the sensor really faulty or did the ECU warning light just need to be reset). He stated that it was just a co-incidence, however I am not so sure. I have a feeling that when the power is disconnected the ECU shows a code 21 (lambda sensor fault) but the sensor is not really faulty.

[francois]

I'm interested to know if the engine management light on the dashboard mght come on because the battery was disconnected? I've read that the oxygen sensor will read as faulty if its power supply has been disconnected.

Anyone have any thoughts on this please??

Cheers,

Gaz

Gaz, I've had to replace my lambda sensor twice, both times immediately after the Battery went flat. I questioned this with my mechanic (i.e. was the sensor really faulty or did the ECU warning light just need to be reset). He stated that it was just a co-incidence, however I am not so sure. I have a feeling that when the power is disconnected the ECU shows a code 21 (lambda sensor fault) but the sensor is not really faulty.

yes, i disconnected my Battery to clean couplings and got check engine light. Diagnosis gave me code 21. I tried resetting the ECU but light still comes on. I have had an unexplaqined intermittent misfire the past few months. Hence its possible my o2 sensors are wonky (would explain misfires) but on the other hand it seems very suspicious that code shouls suddenly appear after disconnecting Battery. No point asking my mechanic as he'll just gleefully run out and get a new o2 sensor and get his spanner out...

francois