Diesel D4d Power Problem

[TangoD4D]

Hi all.

I am new to the forum as I have never had an issue with my CDX D4D 2000cc manual for the last two years but SUDDENLY huge problem.

The story goes that i filled my car from Tesco's as usual although this time it was a little lower than normal and took it home and did very little mileage for the next couple of days before leaving it and going on holiday for a couple of weeks. When I returned I found that i suddenly was unable to accelerate past 40mph. As the Battery was a little flat I thought it was an electrical problem and replaced the Battery and this made no difference so i took it to my local Toyota dealer They took it in and then ran tests that didn’t throw up any codes then literally refused to speak with me for about a week.

I then called on them and they told me that they couldn’t identify the exact problem but suggested they needed to replace the injector pump, common rail and the turbo for £4360 pounds.

Needles to say i declined to take up this kind offer and have booked it into an independent diesel specialist to have a look (going to cost £65 but worth a second opinion I thought) I go next week but wondered if anyone had any thoughts on possible diagnosis. By the way I had difficulty starting it one occasion so was sure it must be fuel related.

Diesel power problem

[TangoD4D]

Hi all.

I am new to the forum as I have never had an issue with my CDX D4D 2000cc manual for the last two years but SUDDENLY huge problem.

The story goes that i filled my car from Tesco's as usual although this time it was a little lower than normal and took it home and did very little mileage for the next couple of days before leaving it and going on holiday for a couple of weeks. When I returned I found that i suddenly was unable to accelerate past 40mph. As the battery was a little flat I thought it was an electrical problem and replaced the battery and this made no difference so i took it to my local Toyota dealer They took it in and then ran tests that didn’t throw up any codes then literally refused to speak with me for about a week.

I then called on them and they told me that they couldn’t identify the exact problem but suggested they needed to replace the injector pump, common rail and the turbo for £4360 pounds.

Needles to say i declined to take up this kind offer and have booked it into an independent diesel specialist to have a look (going to cost £65 but worth a second opinion I thought) I go next week but wondered if anyone had any thoughts on possible diagnosis. By the way I had difficulty starting it one occasion so was sure it must be fuel related.

Diesel power problem

[TangoD4D]

Stranger and stranger!

Just picked up the car from the Toyota garage and the problem had partially resolved. Toyota told me that no code showed up on their tests and just noted that the pressure was low in the common rail down to 13Kpa. On driving it home through the lanes the car behaved fine with absolutely no loss of power!!! Hurah!! and decided to try it on a couple of miles of dual carriageway. Well I had full acceleration and good performance however did notice a little lean performance right at the point of the speed limit. However, a vast improvement fro 30 mph last week!!

The question is what the hells gong on!!

[Rossi46]

Hi TangoD4D

I'm a newbie too and just wanted to assure you there is someone reading your post.

It does seem to be a bit quiet here.

As for your problem it does sound fuel related to me too, fuel pump sounds likely to me.

I reckon you're doing the right thing taking it to a diesel specialist too.

Maybe there's a problem with the Tesco fuel though as apparently they've had issues at certain places.

Good luck though and let us know how you get on. ;)

[TangoD4D]

Very Kind and thanks for the reply. :D

[igormus]

Hi all.

I am new to the forum as I have never had an issue with my CDX D4D 2000cc manual for the last two years but SUDDENLY huge problem.

The story goes that i filled my car from Tesco's as usual although this time it was a little lower than normal and took it home and did very little mileage for the next couple of days before leaving it and going on holiday for a couple of weeks. When I returned I found that i suddenly was unable to accelerate past 40mph. As the battery was a little flat I thought it was an electrical problem and replaced the battery and this made no difference so i took it to my local Toyota dealer They took it in and then ran tests that didn’t throw up any codes then literally refused to speak with me for about a week.

I then called on them and they told me that they couldn’t identify the exact problem but suggested they needed to replace the injector pump, common rail and the turbo for £4360 pounds.

Needles to say i declined to take up this kind offer and have booked it into an independent diesel specialist to have a look (going to cost £65 but worth a second opinion I thought) I go next week but wondered if anyone had any thoughts on possible diagnosis. By the way I had difficulty starting it one occasion so was sure it must be fuel related.

Diesel power problem

hi

look -- i feel that the one of the possible lacks of acceleration is poor fuel delivery after the HP fuel injection pump. The reason is leak of delivery valve/s that must to hold the fuel pressure inside of delivery line up to fuel valves especially in comon rail system. the simple way is to use private fuel injeection specialist and to test each injection pipe, but it demands to manufacture special testing pressure gauge with joints. even you have no idea re fuel injeection pressure value before fuel valves -- but you can see the pressure droping having tested each pipe. in case the pressure is dropped then it is a signal od delivery valve's fault. i do not conside a fault of plunger because the plunger is along that pumps fuel thru distribution plate. in case the plunger does not pump the fuel -- it means the gaps between plunger and barrel are out of limits resulting that you will not start the engine at all (!!!) but you can start it - so the above is for your consideration what to do. It is simply to change the whole pump and I am surprised that you have received this info from officials.

safe your money and ask for assistance especially i well experienced ship's engineer. i had experienced the similar problem and after have tested all four delivery valves i disclosed the one of them is leak (!!!).

good luck//Igor

[TangoD4D]

Thanks Igor,

The specialist firm i am using, repairs injection pumps for other garages. They have agreed to tested it next tuesday. I will let you know the result

[igormus]

Thanks Igor,

The specialist firm i am using, repairs injection pumps for other garages. They have agreed to tested it next tuesday. I will let you know the result

hello again

yes you are on the righgt way.

pls just advise a result

best wishes

Igor

[igormus]

Thanks Igor,

The specialist firm i am using, repairs injection pumps for other garages. They have agreed to tested it next tuesday. I will let you know the result

an donething else -- it is easy to grind the delivery valve using grinding paste with grit of No 250 or less.

it is understood the valve has to be removed from the pump head and after to cleanned in diesel oil and flashed (!!!) otherwise you will bring the same grits into the fuel system and furthemore to fuel valves (!!!)

cheers

[adyb123]

HI

I have recently had this problem with my car.

I've got a 2002 D4D estate.

I had loss of power, foot flat on the floor but going nowhere fast. Took it to Toyota and they gave me the same diagnosis, no code, even though the engine management light had been on.

I have used a couple of tanks of biodiesel, which I was told was better for your car that normal derv.

I was chatting to a guy at work who used to be a mechanic and he suggested checking the fuel filter that I had changed 2 months earlier. Apparently if the o rings are damaged or the seal isn't very good between the filter and the housing then you can get this sort of problem.

So I bought a filter. When I took mine off I found out why I had problems. There was loads of snot in it. Sorry but I can't think of a better description.

I'd post a picture but don't know how.

I filled the new one full of diesel cleaner before I put it back on. Made sure it was good and tight. Put jubilee clips on the pipe, not those spring one that are fitted. I had to prime it by pushing the black button on top until I felt some resistance. Don't push too hard as you can damage the diaphragm inside.

Started first time, goes like a rocket, no engine management light on, idles better. Sorted.

So before you let Toyota loose on your car check the filter.

Hope this helps you.

Adyb

[TangoD4D]

Well Igor I said I would reply and here it is but not with an answer. Having picked up the car last week it has continued to work well. The only noticeable problem was at high speed trying to accelerate past an annoying driver and i got that loss of acceleration. I eased off and all was well. The specialist told me that bringing the car in would be a waste of money and to wait until it played up again so he could trace the problem. I thought it was good advice and will do that. I even considered trading the car in but the best I have been offered on a y 2001 is £2700 and thats just not enough, so I guess I will stick. Realistically I cant match the spec of the car. Its modern T4 spirit level and at best I will probably go to a T3X but would have to have the extra pack.

Last night a friend came up with yet another theory....a fly by wire accelerator switch problem. Said that a number of work vehicles have developed a similar problem and had to have the unit changed. I had no idea it wasn’t a cable and when I looked (standing on my head in the foot well) there was this small unit. umm...guess I will now have to wait and see if it plays up and then have a fiddle!!

[TangoD4D]

sorry wrong place. See further down thread :D

[TangoD4D]

Problem solved then!

I took your advice and ....it worked!

A local mechanic friend agreed that it sounded just like a filter problem or a tank vent blockage similar to one he had encountered on a Renault. I requested that he drain the tank as it seemed that when filled the problem was made much worse and when it got to the light he took it in.

He changed the filter, blew through the fuel lines, removed the panel on the tank (by removing the rear seats to access the tank) and removed the filter pick up (like a tea bag) and rinsed that out and blew through the tank vent.

The filter that had been ‘changed by my local Toyota main dealer at service,’ was brown with age and had a deal of snot in the bowl and the tea bag filter in the tank had a residue all over that had to be removed with petrol, but nothing seemed to be in the diesel that resembled water or a contaminate. Upshot is that once back together the car works fine revving like a goodun with full power throughout the range.

So beware the Toyota technician with a computer! With no code they just want to replace parts that cost a fortune and have no interest in working through the problem logically.

[igormus]

Problem solved then!

I took your advice and ....it worked!

A local mechanic friend agreed that it sounded just like a filter problem or a tank vent blockage similar to one he had encountered on a Renault. I requested that he drain the tank as it seemed that when filled the problem was made much worse and when it got to the light he took it in.

He changed the filter, blew through the fuel lines, removed the panel on the tank (by removing the rear seats to access the tank) and removed the filter pick up (like a tea bag) and rinsed that out and blew through the tank vent.

The filter that had been ‘changed by my local Toyota main dealer at service,’ was brown with age and had a deal of snot in the bowl and the tea bag filter in the tank had a residue all over that had to be removed with petrol, but nothing seemed to be in the diesel that resembled water or a contaminate. Upshot is that once back together the car works fine revving like a goodun with full power throughout the range.

So beware the Toyota technician with a computer! With no code they just want to replace parts that cost a fortune and have no interest in working through the problem logically.

hi

here my CONGRATULATIONS.

cheers/igor

[D4Ddriver]

blew through the fuel lines, removed the panel on the tank (by removing the rear seats to access the tank) and removed the filter pick up (like a tea bag) and rinsed that out and blew through the tank vent.

The filter that had been ‘changed by my local Toyota main dealer at service,’ was brown with age and had a deal of snot in the bowl and the tea bag filter in the tank had a residue all over that had to be removed with petrol, but nothing seemed to be in the diesel that resembled water or a contaminate. Upshot is that once back together the car works fine revving like a goodun with full power throughout the range.

.

Question for you

As a user for 30k plus of biodiesel I read with interest of adyb123's brown snott in the filter assy after using 2 tanks of bio diesel.

Then when you found this fault's cause you mention the same or similar snot.

have you used biodiesel too?

I understand that if you use biodiesel and your tank and lines are coated with sludge from old dirty diesel and many miles, then the cleaning effect of bio will possibly block the fuel filter at 700 miles or so. My supplier told me to change the filter at 700 miles I carried the filter with me for 18k before some bio diesel with soaps in the bottom of the drum made me change the filter.

I now filter all the bio diesel B100 through 5 then 1 micron filters before it reaches the tank.

At the weekend I will inspect the teabag in the tank too.

But pls come back and tell if you have used bio diesel.

thanks

D4D driver

[TangoD4D]

I have known the history of the car since new as it was a fleet car and it has never had anything but forecourt diesel in it. For the last 3 years that I have run the car it has been filled almost exclusively from Tesco's. Interestingly this was a question put to me when I first went to Mr T and they seemed rather disappointed that I said no. I have to say that I am increasingly cross that the filter wasn’t changed at service as standard, but realistically cannot challenge any one garage as I am told the replacement isn’t automatic.

I just wonder how clean garage diesel is? I know that there was an issue with supermarket petrol last year and wonder if they are trying out new additives??

[matty2767]

slightly off topic but i stopped using supermarket diesel last year after the issue with contaminated fuel. the Shell and bp garages round here are 2p/litre more expensive but i dont think it is worth the risk to use tescos any more.

[TangoD4D]

I think you may be right! Having gone through a quite traumatic (wet lettuce award coming up here) month. I really don’t want to go back there. I would like to thank all the people who responded and read the thread. You do feel quite alone when you deal with shysters and the forum was a lifeline.

[mountainman]

HI guys,

sorry to hijack the thread if you want filters for bio in 5 and 1 micron i can do them for you.This is only for bulk not car fitment, check the link www.plastok.co.uk

Cheers MOUNTAINMAN

[mountainman]

Sorry didn't mention that the "snot" is in fact glycerin and sugars where the bio was not washed and filtered properly

MOUNTAINMAN

[OldSkoO1]

It is very important to use good fuel and to know how to clean out the excessive soot from the combustion process.

Firstly good fuel like Shell and bp have a higher concentrate of additives to clean the injectors and to break down particles that can find their way into your engine oil and effect lubricity and thermal dissipation and cooling which can increase wear; basically reducing the effectiveness of the oil. The filters do their job but continuously putting in poor grade fuel can lead to saturation and then the reduced ability to filter.

Some fuels whilst cheap and readily available aren't the cleanest fuels to use. Most fuels come from base stock but companies do do their own filtration processes and use different concentrates and even additional additives from each other. Secondly, taking your car up to maximum rev's (when i say maximum revs i dont mean red line; my deisel T180 has a red line of 5k but max power / revs is reached at 4k, this is all it needs) once a week will help blow and clean out the soot from your injections and move the soot through your system. A lot of diesel drivers dont get to this range because its too easy to rely on the torque around 2 to 2.5k.

Its worth trying to stick to this to keep your car in good shape. Fuel is like food for us, fill your body full of low quality foods and you are more likely to end up with health problems and sooner.

[D4Ddriver]

Sorry didn't mention that the "snot" is in fact glycerin and sugars where the bio was not washed and filtered properly

MOUNTAINMAN

Yes this was what I suspected too but the car had not had any bio in it at all. Brown gum stuff Snot has to be from the diesel.

thanks for the filter link

[TangoD4D]

Being a bit of a sad git I always keep all the receipts whenever I buy or have anything serviced. Forms a bit of a pile, but when speaking to a friend of my upset over the filter issue with Mr T and their inability to diagnose a blocked fuel filter.

He enquired if I had any documented evidence that Toyota had ever changed it. Well reviewing the H&S safety schedule and visual safety report procedure guide (check list at service) he found that the filter should be changed every 40K or 6 years. Digging around he then found the relevant form (40k) where the filter change had been put down as NA. This then proved that they never change it and it was just a matter of time before it blocked.

Interestingly enough this chap is a corporate lawyer. He then spent ten minutes explaining what I could do and suggested that if I could claim loss I might be able to get compensation.

Whilst I don’t hold out any hope personally it might be worth the time to point out this issue as Toyota always sell us the product on the quality of the build and after care.

What I would like to achieve is that if the older generation take their car in to Toyota they i) get what they pay for & ii) get a fair quote for work they actually need on their car. ie not be quoted 4k for unnecessary work or worse be ripped off!

top tip...keep all the paperwork!

[D4Ddriver]

How did your mechanic manage to remove the panel from the top of the tank?

Mine wont budge and I would like to see if this teabag strainer is bunged up.

Yes I can use injector cleaner in the tank but to realy confirm its clean I could do with seeing it. Any feed back on how to open the lid appreciated.

[TangoD4D]

Leave it with me and I will contact him tomorrow! :)