Throttle Body Coolant Bypass

[Uber_Luke]

I'm an engineer and I can't help but yawn. (trying to find yawn smiley)

this should suffice

Snap - I too am an engineer.

Shouldn't it be ... BASH/SMASH - I too am an engineer

[mr-p]

[Phil01]

what James is saying is correct about needing a water heated TB,

Please dont take this the wrong way, but most of you are at an age, (young) to always had the luxury of this device fitted to modern cars, in my days long before all of this emissions crap and TB/manifold heaters, freezing of the intake was a coomon problem, its the ambient air laden with moisture and this will adhere to any metal surface on the inlet side caused by the evap of fuel etc, this then freezes causing anything to Jam/block?seize.

I had this scenario as recent as in the Carina AT151, the carb iced up and lost total power, and misfire, same sypmtons as a crack dizzy cap.

My advise is leave it in place..

And please do not reply saying what a load of ba11s, because both of us are correct.

[Phil01]

yeah i could let them know but then they would need two production lines. 1 for my car and one for all those people who live in country's that do actually have a proper winter where there is a risk of something going wrong ie north america!!! so it would actually cost them more to make the 2 parts !!!!!

Many people are mistaken this has to do with the climate ambient temperature. Cars in hot climates and areas of high humidity also suffer.

The heat from the coolant isn't to change the incoming air temperature its to reduce the effects of latent heat being drawn from the fuel device. It's exactly the same principle as to how a fridge works.

Let's look at it this way. If you dip your finger into petrol and then take it out - why does your finger feel cold. It's because as the petrol is evaporating it is actually drawing heat from your finger. Apply this principle to the fuel device. As the fuel flows and is sprayed the body of the unit with loose heat to point where the mouisture in the incoming air will condense and then freeze blocking the fuel outlets which will be the coldest component.

Just as your body compensates when you try the petrol example so the warm coolant has the same effect.

I'm an engineer and I can't help but yawn. (trying to find yawn smiley)

nrgizerbunny,, you are so wrong with that , yawning smiley, hat james is saying is totally correct, its just your lack of understanding, sorry mate,

[Phil01]

and icing up can occur with air intake temps as high as 5 degrees C, as the airflow thro the TB/manifold causes windchill enough to freeze the adhere moisture, and trust me this can happen in seconds

[Jamesbelfast]

There have been such incidents in the tropics simply because of the high humidity of the ambient atmosphere.

[mr-p]

exactly HIGH HUMIDITY ! means lots of water vapour in the air, more vapour = the greater the chance of the vapour freezing (its more common for it to happen on a nice sunny day than a cold dry day because of the greater volume of vapour in the ambient air) as i said in this country where southend is about as tropical as it gets its just not going to be a factor on a modern car.

never said james was wrong at all

carbs are a bit different really though because the fuel is mixed very close to the air intake thus increasing the effects of heat of evaporation. air pressure drops because of the expansion caused by engine induction and the increase in speed through the butterfly valve which drops the air temperature further. they normally end up freezing around the venturi and worst of all the whole carb will freeze as you probably know.

[nrgizerbunny]

yeah i could let them know but then they would need two production lines. 1 for my car and one for all those people who live in country's that do actually have a proper winter where there is a risk of something going wrong ie north america!!! so it would actually cost them more to make the 2 parts !!!!!

Many people are mistaken this has to do with the climate ambient temperature. Cars in hot climates and areas of high humidity also suffer.

The heat from the coolant isn't to change the incoming air temperature its to reduce the effects of latent heat being drawn from the fuel device. It's exactly the same principle as to how a fridge works.

Let's look at it this way. If you dip your finger into petrol and then take it out - why does your finger feel cold. It's because as the petrol is evaporating it is actually drawing heat from your finger. Apply this principle to the fuel device. As the fuel flows and is sprayed the body of the unit with loose heat to point where the mouisture in the incoming air will condense and then freeze blocking the fuel outlets which will be the coldest component.

Just as your body compensates when you try the petrol example so the warm coolant has the same effect.

I'm an engineer and I can't help but yawn. (trying to find yawn smiley)

nrgizerbunny,, you are so wrong with that , yawning smiley, hat james is saying is totally correct, its just your lack of understanding, sorry mate,

I might scan in my degree certificate to show lack of understanding.

[Jamesbelfast]

The effects of latent heat through evaporation can occur in a sealed system without the presence of air or a passing airflow. A refrigerator cooling coil is one example.

[Uber_Luke]

When I chew an ice cube it hurts...

[mr-p]

may need to see a dentist about that????

[madvinegar]

No need to argue. Everyone makes his own choices and is responsible for them.

I tried it and I did not like it because I lost the smooth operation of my engine. I believe that the gains of such a move (if any) are not noticable, and on the contrary there may be a chance to cause a problem to the engine itself.

Of course this is my hamble opinion. Everyone is free to do as he pleases.

[mr-p]

well said lol

going to do it tomorrow as ill finish work before it gets dark! if any one wants any pics let me know

[Phil01]

yeah i could let them know but then they would need two production lines. 1 for my car and one for all those people who live in country's that do actually have a proper winter where there is a risk of something going wrong ie north america!!! so it would actually cost them more to make the 2 parts !!!!!

Many people are mistaken this has to do with the climate ambient temperature. Cars in hot climates and areas of high humidity also suffer.

The heat from the coolant isn't to change the incoming air temperature its to reduce the effects of latent heat being drawn from the fuel device. It's exactly the same principle as to how a fridge works.

Let's look at it this way. If you dip your finger into petrol and then take it out - why does your finger feel cold. It's because as the petrol is evaporating it is actually drawing heat from your finger. Apply this principle to the fuel device. As the fuel flows and is sprayed the body of the unit with loose heat to point where the mouisture in the incoming air will condense and then freeze blocking the fuel outlets which will be the coldest component.

Just as your body compensates when you try the petrol example so the warm coolant has the same effect.

I'm an engineer and I can't help but yawn. (trying to find yawn smiley)

nrgizerbunny,, you are so wrong with that , yawning smiley, hat james is saying is totally correct, its just your lack of understanding, sorry mate,

I might scan in my degree certificate to show lack of understanding.

I cant be naffed to scan my certs, take too long, sorry mate but I was prob fixing cars when you was a little toddler.

Just you need an understanding,,

Phil01 Status: Online

Phil01 has no status. Edit

Tech Rep

[nrgizerbunny]

Read the supercharger thread and see if you still think I don't understand.

[corollat3sport]

keep it friendly guys :)

[wangtastic]

To add to the argument my friend Tighe has done exactly what mr-p asked in his Honda with no ill effect what so ever.

he has had the car for about 5 years and I believe the mod has been in place for 3 of those five, if that helps affect your decision.

[etihad]

yeah i could let them know but then they would need two production lines. 1 for my car and one for all those people who live in country's that do actually have a proper winter where there is a risk of something going wrong ie north america!!! so it would actually cost them more to make the 2 parts !!!!!

Many people are mistaken this has to do with the climate ambient temperature. Cars in hot climates and areas of high humidity also suffer.

The heat from the coolant isn't to change the incoming air temperature its to reduce the effects of latent heat being drawn from the fuel device. It's exactly the same principle as to how a fridge works.

Let's look at it this way. If you dip your finger into petrol and then take it out - why does your finger feel cold. It's because as the petrol is evaporating it is actually drawing heat from your finger. Apply this principle to the fuel device. As the fuel flows and is sprayed the body of the unit with loose heat to point where the mouisture in the incoming air will condense and then freeze blocking the fuel outlets which will be the coldest component.

Just as your body compensates when you try the petrol example so the warm coolant has the same effect.

I'm an engineer and I can't help but yawn. (trying to find yawn smiley)

nrgizerbunny,, you are so wrong with that , yawning smiley, hat james is saying is totally correct, its just your lack of understanding, sorry mate,

I might scan in my degree certificate to show lack of understanding.

What is said is true. Same reason planes have carb heat. Got the shock of my life 9 months ago as i descended 2000ft only to forget carb heat on cold with low rpm and engine started stuttering, if i hadn't noticed it in time i would of soiled my seat.

[mr-p]

[Uber_Luke]

Lesson 1 - If Your are going to bypass the coolant on your throttle body, DO NOT go above 2000Ft