Whats The Chances Of This Happening Twice?

[Mistermena]

Hi all,

I'd been looking for quite some time for an Avensis T-180 estate in a dark metalic grey. One came up on eBay (Of all places!) that looked in fantasic condition having rear parking sensors and the pop up dash sat nav.

The car had covered a little over 105000 miles (Late 2007 model year) and looked to be going for a good price being a 1 owner car. So Looking at the reg I contacted my local main dealer (Who were very helpful) to ask if they could pull up the service history. I found out that a new "Short engine" and CAT,EGR ect at 990000 miles and a full main dealer service history, so I thought fantastic! like having a brand new car but without the price tag.

So I bid on the car and won the auction over the other bidders (32 in all) by just £100! You could imagine how pleased I was to get the car and spec that I wanted. So we collected the car and it was exactly as described, in near mint condition with 4 brand new Goodyear boots on her.

I'd read alot on here about the 2.2 heavy oil engines having problem with the head gaskets going on them but slept well that night knowing that my car had a new engine from Toyota.

After about 2000 miles (Which is all I've done in the car) I started to notice that the coolant level was starting to drop and there was a black tinge appearing in the coolant. It started to cross my mind that the head gasket was failing! But then I thought, it can't be as its had a new engine and new modified pistons/head etc. I continued to monitor the levels for a couple of weeks and it still dropped but only by very small amounts. There were no other indications that the gasket was failing as the cabin heater was working as it should blowing out red hot air.

So after speaking to a member on here "Ormi" and asking his advise (He's a tech for Toyota and very helpful indeed) I thought I'd better take the car into the dealer to let them have a look see. Well as you've probably worked out the head gasket had gone again and a new engine had to be fitted after only covering about 8000 miles on a NEW engine.

The car went in last friday and I picked it up today and it seems to all good again! I have to commend Toyota on there pro active approach towards the 2.2 engine problem, and having put the 112k mile warranty in place or this would have cost me well over 5k to sort out.

So just a word of warning to anyone who has had a new engine fitted and thinks that maybe (Like me) that its all good! Just take another look at that coolant and if its dropping contact your dealer.

Toyota Cardiff have done everything they can to help us with the repair of our car. Supplying us with a courtesy car for the 6 days they had it (Getting our car back 1 day early than estimated) and I have to say that the service we recieved was to the highest standards.

Well done Toyota Cardiff

[t-spiritpete]

Hi all,

I'd been looking for quite some time for an Avensis T-180 estate in a dark metalic grey. One came up on Ebay (Of all places!) that looked in fantasic condition having rear parking sensors and the pop up dash sat nav.

The car had covered a little over 105000 miles and looked to be going for a good price being a 1 owner car. So Looking at the reg I contacted my local main dealer (Who was very helpful indeed) to ask if they could pull up the service history. I found out that a new "Short engine" and CAT at 990000 miles and a full main dealer service history, so I thought fantastic! like having a brand new car but without the price tag.

So I bid on the car and won the auction over the other bidders (32 in all) by just £100! You could imagine how pleased I was to get the car and spec that I wanted. So we collected the car and it was exactly as described, in near mint condition with 4 brand new Goodyear boots on her.

I'd read alot on here about the 2.2 derv engines having problem with the head gaskets going on them but slept well that night knowing that my car had a new engine from Toyota.

After about 2000 miles (Which is all I've done in the car) I started to notice that the coolant level was starting to drop and there was a black tinge appearing in the coolant. It started to cross my mind that the head gasket was failing! But then I thought, it can't be as its had a new engine and new modified pistons/head etc. I continued to monitor the levels for a couple of weeks and it still dropped but only by very small amounts. There were no other indications that the gasket was failing as the cabin heater was working as it should blowing out red hot air.

So after speaking to a member on here "Ormi" and asking his advise (He's a tech for Toyota and very helpful indeed) I thought I'd better take the car into the dealer to let them have a look see. Well as you've probably worked out the head gasket had gone again and a new engine had to be fitted after only covering about 8000 miles on a NEW engine.

The car went in last friday and I picked it up today and it seems to all good again! I have to commend Toyota on there pro active approach towards the 2.2 engine problem, and having put the 112k mile warranty in place or this would have cost me well over 5k to sort out.

So just a word of warning to anyone who has had a new engine fitted and thinks that maybe (Like me) that its all good! Just take another look at that coolant and if its dropping contact your dealer.

Toyota Cardiff have done everything they can to help us with the repair of our car. Supplying us with a courtesy car for the 6 days they had it (Getting our car back 1 day early) and I have to say that the service we recieved was to the highest standards.

Well done Toyota Cardiff

Hi mate, that's what I call a result and well done to Toyota for doing the right thing, I can't think of any other manufacturer who would have done that!!! Shout it from the roof tops Mistermena! . :D

Pete.

[Mistermena]

Hi Pete,

Yer I think that Mr T has done a very good job on recognising the problem and setting about sorting things out for us 2.2 oil burner owners. The cars engines are worth more that the car now! lol...

I was toying with an idea about selling it when this happened. But I love driving it and I think that the engine (When working properly) is the best diesel I've ever driven, and I've had everything from VW's to Audi's to Vauxhalls. And nothing comes close in my view

[Daveyonthemove]

Thats great news, i'm glad it was sorted at no cost to you, especially with such high mileage and after being 'fixed' once.

I've yet to see any other manufacturer honour a warranty like that before.

[Mistermena]

Thats great news, i'm glad it was sorted at no cost to you, especially with such high mileage and after being 'fixed' once.

I've yet to see any other manufacturer honour a warranty like that before.

Cheers Davey

I've never heard of a manufactuer honoring a warranty like Toyota have either. I think its a step that others should follow. I'd buy another Toyota again after seeing how well they've done. A mate of mine has a Ford and he says there useless!

[Daveyonthemove]

I agree with your mate, as my last car was a Ford and both the car and the dealer were rubbish.

[Pat2u]

Having owned several new vehicles from toyota "too many" i have nothing but praise for my local dealership, any problems have been dealt with 100% my car a T180 tourer i hope will be my last new motor, it recently had a leak on it after the engine had been removed for oil burning the s/f oil seal was replaced on the drive shaft at no charge "yes" they are a brand i would recommend.

Thanks for pointing out the fault re water loss, i will be keeping an eye on my level.

[mrmoosehead]

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but how come you've had a new (short) engine if it's only a gasket problem?

[Mistermena]

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but how come you've had a new (short) engine if it's only a gasket problem?

Not a stupid question at all mate.

Because if the gasket has "Shuffled" it can cause damage to the crank/pistons/bearings/block ect. So you cant just replace the gasket and cure the leak/problem. Its an engine out job and a new one put in. This didn't happen that much years ago on the older cast iron blocks. But now the engines are alloy and this seems to happen more and more. But the weight on new engines are half what they use to be near enough.

I'm starting to wonder if the coolant has something to do with the gaskets going on modern engines.

[Mistermena]

Having owned several new vehicles from toyota "too many" i have nothing but praise for my local dealership, any problems have been dealt with 100% my car a T180 tourer i hope will be my last new motor, it recently had a leak on it after the engine had been removed for oil burning the s/f oil seal was replaced on the drive shaft at no charge "yes" they are a brand i would recommend.

Thanks for pointing out the fault re water loss, i will be keeping an eye on my level.

Hi Pat,

I like you wanted to buy a car that would last our family for many years to come. Having 9 airbags and a good size boot was one of the key points I looked for when I researched the car. Having the 180 bhp was a massive bonus as well as all the toys on the T-180. Its good to know that Toyota are putting there customes 1st when it comes to issues.

Its nice to have some positives to comment about a manufacture and the dealers that are in the front line when things go wrong. I'm glad to hear that Mr T sorted out your car at no cost to you. A positive result for you and Toyota UK.

[ministeve]

i have to admit i am a little worried about the head problems i have been reading about since i have just bought a 44000 d-4d 2.2 tr 07 plate tourer from the local toyota dealer the car was supplied by them to a lady who has just replaced it with the new model i hope my new car will be a good one fingers crossed

steve

[Mistermena]

i have to admit i am a little worried about the head problems i have been reading about since i have just bought a 44000 d-4d 2.2 tr 07 plate tourer from the local toyota dealer the car was supplied by them to a lady who has just replaced it with the new model i hope my new car will be a good one fingers crossed

steve

Hi Steve,

The thing about forums like we are on is it tends to just highlight cars that have problems. There will be many thousands of T-180's and 2.2 D4-D that dont suffer any problems at all, or very few.

If you have any concerns about your car I'd do what I did and hot foot it down to the dealer for them do a pressure test. At the end of the day if its covered under warranty its not going to cost you a penny! And lets not forget the dealers make money out of Toyota for warranty work undertaken. So its a win, win situation all round.

[ministeve]

yes you are right mister i am looking forward to many years of good motoring with toyota. i have to admit i now really like the brand after only a few days driving one.

steve

[Red diesel]

Hi all,

I'd been looking for quite some time for an Avensis T-180 estate in a dark metalic grey. One came up on Ebay (Of all places!) that looked in fantasic condition having rear parking sensors and the pop up dash sat nav.

The car had covered a little over 105000 miles and looked to be going for a good price being a 1 owner car. So Looking at the reg I contacted my local main dealer (Who was very helpful indeed) to ask if they could pull up the service history. I found out that a new "Short engine" and CAT at 990000 miles and a full main dealer service history, so I thought fantastic! like having a brand new car but without the price tag.

So I bid on the car and won the auction over the other bidders (32 in all) by just £100! You could imagine how pleased I was to get the car and spec that I wanted. So we collected the car and it was exactly as described, in near mint condition with 4 brand new Goodyear boots on her.

I'd read alot on here about the 2.2 derv engines having problem with the head gaskets going on them but slept well that night knowing that my car had a new engine from Toyota.

After about 2000 miles (Which is all I've done in the car) I started to notice that the coolant level was starting to drop and there was a black tinge appearing in the coolant. It started to cross my mind that the head gasket was failing! But then I thought, it can't be as its had a new engine and new modified pistons/head etc. I continued to monitor the levels for a couple of weeks and it still dropped but only by very small amounts. There were no other indications that the gasket was failing as the cabin heater was working as it should blowing out red hot air.

So after speaking to a member on here "Ormi" and asking his advise (He's a tech for Toyota and very helpful indeed) I thought I'd better take the car into the dealer to let them have a look see. Well as you've probably worked out the head gasket had gone again and a new engine had to be fitted after only covering about 8000 miles on a NEW engine.

The car went in last friday and I picked it up today and it seems to all good again! I have to commend Toyota on there pro active approach towards the 2.2 engine problem, and having put the 112k mile warranty in place or this would have cost me well over 5k to sort out.

So just a word of warning to anyone who has had a new engine fitted and thinks that maybe (Like me) that its all good! Just take another look at that coolant and if its dropping contact your dealer.

Toyota Cardiff have done everything they can to help us with the repair of our car. Supplying us with a courtesy car for the 6 days they had it (Getting our car back 1 day early) and I have to say that the service we recieved was to the highest standards.

Well done Toyota Cardiff

Hi mate, that's what I call a result and well done to Toyota for doing the right thing, I can't think of any other manufacturer who would have done that!!! Shout it from the roof tops Mistermena! . :D

Pete.

I wouldn't go jumping for joy at Toyota service just yet - i think that with these things

its very much luck of the draw. I know others on here haven't had the same high standard of service from Toyota. I wonder if this good service is purely down to the dealer (well done to them) at a local level. I wonder this because i know someone who had serious trouble with a certain german manufacturer and one of their cars. Dealer no 1 was making the customer pay for all repairs (car out of warranty - but it was a monday morning car). Went to a 2nd main dealer for the brand - and dealer 2 was automatically without the customer asking putting everything through to the manufacturer under "grievance procedure".

I would be inclined to think that you simply got a faulty engine 2nd time around because

although these 2.2s do fail - i would say the chances of it doing so after 8000 miles is remarkably slim. But heres a question though - this 112 000 mile warranty thing - does that apply to the engine (so your new engine would be covered right up to when the car has 200 k miles done. Or is it based on the cars total mileage, i would expect that if a car had

111 000 miles done and had a new engine fitted and the new engine from Toyota failed at

130 000 miles (total car mileage) then Toyota will deal with the situation on the basis that yes the car has done more than the 112 000 miles but the brand new engine supplied by Toyota at 111 000 miles has failed after just 19 000 miles. But im probably using too much logic. Either way to the OP hopefully your car will give you good service and the new engine serves you well.

Red diesel

[ormi]

glad i could be of help mate and glad you got it sorted....i'll dig some pics out of the damage caused by gasket shuffle and post them up...

[Mistermena]

glad i could be of help mate and glad you got it sorted....i'll dig some pics out of the damage caused by gasket shuffle and post them up...

Nice on mate. That would be good to see. And thanks again for your help :thumbsup:

[ormi]

skimmimg the block and head isnt allowed....anyway heres a few pics of a rebuild i've just done so people can understand the damage thats done...

the head

close up

and the block

hopes this sheds some light....

also someone asked why you get new pistons........ the pistons are mated to the block thats the reason.

[Mistermena]

Hi all,

I'd been looking for quite some time for an Avensis T-180 estate in a dark metalic grey. One came up on Ebay (Of all places!) that looked in fantasic condition having rear parking sensors and the pop up dash sat nav.

The car had covered a little over 105000 miles and looked to be going for a good price being a 1 owner car. So Looking at the reg I contacted my local main dealer (Who was very helpful indeed) to ask if they could pull up the service history. I found out that a new "Short engine" and CAT at 990000 miles and a full main dealer service history, so I thought fantastic! like having a brand new car but without the price tag.

So I bid on the car and won the auction over the other bidders (32 in all) by just £100! You could imagine how pleased I was to get the car and spec that I wanted. So we collected the car and it was exactly as described, in near mint condition with 4 brand new Goodyear boots on her.

I'd read alot on here about the 2.2 derv engines having problem with the head gaskets going on them but slept well that night knowing that my car had a new engine from Toyota.

After about 2000 miles (Which is all I've done in the car) I started to notice that the coolant level was starting to drop and there was a black tinge appearing in the coolant. It started to cross my mind that the head gasket was failing! But then I thought, it can't be as its had a new engine and new modified pistons/head etc. I continued to monitor the levels for a couple of weeks and it still dropped but only by very small amounts. There were no other indications that the gasket was failing as the cabin heater was working as it should blowing out red hot air.

So after speaking to a member on here "Ormi" and asking his advise (He's a tech for Toyota and very helpful indeed) I thought I'd better take the car into the dealer to let them have a look see. Well as you've probably worked out the head gasket had gone again and a new engine had to be fitted after only covering about 8000 miles on a NEW engine.

The car went in last friday and I picked it up today and it seems to all good again! I have to commend Toyota on there pro active approach towards the 2.2 engine problem, and having put the 112k mile warranty in place or this would have cost me well over 5k to sort out.

So just a word of warning to anyone who has had a new engine fitted and thinks that maybe (Like me) that its all good! Just take another look at that coolant and if its dropping contact your dealer.

Toyota Cardiff have done everything they can to help us with the repair of our car. Supplying us with a courtesy car for the 6 days they had it (Getting our car back 1 day early) and I have to say that the service we recieved was to the highest standards.

Well done Toyota Cardiff

Hi mate, that's what I call a result and well done to Toyota for doing the right thing, I can't think of any other manufacturer who would have done that!!! Shout it from the roof tops Mistermena! . :D

Pete.

I wouldn't go jumping for joy at Toyota service just yet - i think that with these things

its very much luck of the draw. I know others on here haven't had the same high standard of service from Toyota. I wonder if this good service is purely down to the dealer (well done to them) at a local level. I wonder this because i know someone who had serious trouble with a certain german manufacturer and one of their cars. Dealer no 1 was making the customer pay for all repairs (car out of warranty - but it was a monday morning car). Went to a 2nd main dealer for the brand - and dealer 2 was automatically without the customer asking putting everything through to the manufacturer under "grievance procedure".

I would be inclined to think that you simply got a faulty engine 2nd time around because

although these 2.2s do fail - i would say the chances of it doing so after 8000 miles is remarkably slim. But heres a question though - this 112 000 mile warranty thing - does that apply to the engine (so your new engine would be covered right up to when the car has 200 k miles done. Or is it based on the cars total mileage, i would expect that if a car had

111 000 miles done and had a new engine fitted and the new engine from Toyota failed at

130 000 miles (total car mileage) then Toyota will deal with the situation on the basis that yes the car has done more than the 112 000 miles but the brand new engine supplied by Toyota at 111 000 miles has failed after just 19 000 miles. But im probably using too much logic. Either way to the OP hopefully your car will give you good service and the new engine serves you well.

Red diesel

I think you may well be correct in saying that I just might have a very good dealer who simply go that extra mile to help there customers. If that is the case then I'm very thankfull to Toyota Cardiff for helping me out. I've found that in the past with other brands that if I've had a problem and they can't or wont help I've gone to another dealer. I had a problem with a tape deck in my VW that kept on chewing up the tapes and the dealer said there was nothing wrong with it. So I took it to another and showed them what happened (Whilst the tech was in the car with an old tape) and true to form it did the same thing! So a new unit was put in and its been good ever since.

I think that it would be a very rare thing to happenen that a "New" engine should fail after such a short amount of time to. I will be sending an email to Toyota UK to ask what assurances they can provide me that this 2nd "New" engine isn't going to fail outside the 112k extended warrany scheme leaving me with a massive bill for a 3rd engine. In my email I will also be asking the question you posed about what milage the warranty will cover. I suspect that it will only be upto the original 112k! But I will let everyone know the outcome of that when Toyota respond.

I'm now hoping that this engine will last like my VW Polo TDi has, which to date has 194k on the clock and runs as good today as when I bought it brand new in 2003. Time will tell

[Mistermena]

skimmimg the block and head isnt allowed....anyway heres a few pics of a rebuild i've just done so people can understand the damage thats done...

the head

close up

and the block

hopes this sheds some light....

also someone asked why you get new pistons........ the pistons are mated to the block thats the reason.

Thanks for posting the pics mate. Its good to be able to see what damage is done when the gasket goes. Is there a particular reason why they fail so much on the 2.2 oil burners? Poor quality metals or suppliers of the original gaskets?

[ormi]

they think its down to the coating on the gasket wearing away which increases the gap between head and gasket and block and gaske....

they have modified gaskets for them now so i can only asume the last rebuild used the old style gasket......

[Mistermena]

they think its down to the coating on the gasket wearing away which increases the gap between head and gasket and block and gaske....

they have modified gaskets for them now so i can only asume the last rebuild used the old style gasket......

Its a real shame if they used the old style gasket. As you know how long it takes to re-build an engine! I would have thought that the fitter would have brought this up with the workshop manager before replacing the head. But maybe they couldn't get hold of the modified gaskets in time for the re-build.

I wonder what Toyota UK will have to say to the dealership that carried out the origina re-build? As I'm sure that they wont be that happy to have had to pay out twice plus labour for new engines...