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I Don't Think I Will Buy Another Toyota...


taximark
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And im gutted about this as well!

I currently have a 1998 Avensis gls that i use for a taxi business and it's been incredable for reliability - well over 225 miles and one clutch and g/box bearing!

Now i bet you're wondering why im not bothering with the new ones? well this is why - taxi drivers in general get to know what good cars are and we put them through the toughest test of all (miles and weight).

Alarmingly loads of taxi drivers who previously had Mk 1 Avensis's like mine thought that the great reliability would continue through onto the new ones - sadly this is not the case.

The main problems that they are having is on the d4d diesels both mk2 and new-shape models. The main problem being the Engine flywheel.

I know this has been a problem or weak area on these but just last week 3 new shape avensis's all suffered the same plight - a flywheel disintegrating when driving costing over 2k to repair!

Now that is worrying for such a well built car to have a major engine fault like that.

Hate to sat this because i do love Toyota's and mine's been great (leanburn ofcorse) but i have decided not to get Avensis and instead going for a Diesel Passat 130.

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Well its a shame to hear your leaving the Avensis fold. Good luck with the Passat (I think you're gonna need it) Keep us posted on how you get on with it!

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Yep I have to say good luck to. You may turn out to like your passat, and in the scheme of things they are a nice car to drive.

But if it's a reliable car you are after, then you are making the wrong choice i'm afraid. Expect electrical faults gallore.

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All very well in saying but all my taxi buddies are slagging the new Toyota's off saying how poor the reliability on them are especially the Oil problem on the 1.8 and the flywheel on the d4d - as for the Passat everyone that has one keeps raving on about how good they are with very little if any problems at all.

Now as i have stated before if the Toyota didn't have these problems i would jump at one but for me reliability has to come first as it's my job and transport and sadly the car in front seems to be getting overtaken by V.W.

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I totally agree with Taximark on this, afterall Taxi drivers are the ones who drive cars everyday lots of miles, and they'll soon find cars which have the trouble. I must admit after years of seeing CarinaII's, CarinaE's and original Avensis, there does seem to be very few new shape Avensis doing the rounds, I have seen a few 2.4 Camry's round here, but Skoda Octavia and Superb's seem to be in the majority now.

I hope you find your Passat is OK, I remember when I had my original Avensis I noticed how poor it was compared to Japanese built Toyota's and said i'd never have another after that, and from the looks of it, I had one of the better Avensis.

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Although the skoda uses a lot of the same parts, they are put together by different people.

Sorry mate, but the VW's have a poor reliability record with the electrics.

But then again the Avensis seems to have it's own problems. But believe me, if it's not another Toyota you want just think carefully before the VW purchase.

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And im gutted about this as well!

I currently have a 1998 Avensis gls that i use for a taxi business and it's been incredable for reliability - well over 225 miles and one clutch and g/box bearing!

Now i bet you're wondering why im not bothering with the new ones? well this is why - taxi drivers in general get to know what good cars are and we put them through the toughest test of all (miles and weight).

Alarmingly loads of taxi drivers who previously had Mk 1 Avensis's like mine thought that the great reliability would continue through onto the new ones - sadly this is not the case.

The main problems that they are having is on the d4d diesels both mk2 and new-shape models. The main problem being the Engine flywheel.

I know this has been a problem or weak area on these but just last week 3 new shape avensis's all suffered the same plight - a flywheel disintegrating when driving costing over 2k to repair!

Now that is worrying for such a well built car to have a major engine fault like that.

Hate to sat this because i do love Toyota's and mine's been great (leanburn ofcorse) but i have decided not to get Avensis and instead going for a Diesel Passat 130.

we really didnt have problems with flywheels ever on new Avensis D4D. Its pretty damn reliable engine and whole car. Besides minor niggles, only problem was with front lights that got fixed 2 years ago... We had few over 100,000k km mark, pretty happy drivers.

As to the Passat 130, thats the one I hear horror stories about... brand new sucking way too much Oil from start and not getting any better.

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And im gutted about this as well!

I currently have a 1998 Avensis gls that i use for a taxi business and it's been incredable for reliability - well over 225 miles and one clutch and g/box bearing!

Now i bet you're wondering why im not bothering with the new ones? well this is why - taxi drivers in general get to know what good cars are and we put them through the toughest test of all (miles and weight).

Alarmingly loads of taxi drivers who previously had Mk 1 Avensis's like mine thought that the great reliability would continue through onto the new ones - sadly this is not the case.

The main problems that they are having is on the d4d diesels both mk2 and new-shape models. The main problem being the Engine flywheel.

I know this has been a problem or weak area on these but just last week 3 new shape avensis's all suffered the same plight - a flywheel disintegrating when driving costing over 2k to repair!

Now that is worrying for such a well built car to have a major engine fault like that.

Hate to sat this because i do love Toyota's and mine's been great (leanburn ofcorse) but i have decided not to get Avensis and instead going for a Diesel Passat 130.

I've done over 80,000 miles in my D-4D without a hint of a problem, service it myself, at least 2 Oil changes a year and it runs like a Swiss watch.

I'm not just saying this but I have heard many bad things about VW diesels, aside from electrical problems mentioned earlier, major engine failure, gearbox failure on low mileage cars, huge Oil consumption etc...not to mention the plumes of smoke that seem to come out of every VW stable diesel engine, my D-4D blows out daisies.

Almost every taxi in my area is a Carina or Avensis Mk1/2 only ever see the odd VW and Skoda, but good luck anyway.

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I'm just going on the record of taxi drivers that i know pal, and with reference to the mileage the problems seem to be happening around 100k mark which for a taxi is two years running.

To be honest whatever the car whether it's a Avensis,Passat or Superb you are always going to get people disagreeing regarding certain problems.

What I'm going by is the fact that currently more problems is happening to Avensis's then Passat's or Superbs.

Maybe Toyota's doesn't like the hills in Sheffield.

With regards to my current car (Avensis mk1) why can't Toyota go back to lean-burn engines - they are quality!

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Fair comment: I had three VW TDIs and never had a problem over 250K miles. The dealers....well that's another story.

Which has led me back to Toyota after a 15 year gap only to find I have an engine (1.8 vvti) that may start drinking Oil any day soon and need a new engine. Which may or may not cost me an arm or a leg depending on the attitude of my local dealer.

Does anyone know whether all 1.8 vvtis (mine is a 2002) suffer from the Oil problem? Or is it pot luck?

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Does anyone know whether all 1.8 vvtis (mine is a 2002) suffer from the oil problem? Or is it pot luck?

There's a batch which is particularly bad for it, but there appears to be a few outside of it aswell, including some of the replacement engines that people have had according to previous posts on here.

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Heard a taxi driver from Hertfordshire on the radio consumer programme yesterday complaining about a Ford Focus. He is very unhappy with its reliability. Asked what was the most popular taxi with his colleagues he stated it was the Toyota because of its reliability.

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there can't be any comparison between AVENSIS and PASSAT,because the reliability of AVENSIS is much higher than the passaat's :yes: .if you don't believe it look what the germans from TUV say :eek: ./this organization is making the technical inspection of the whole auto-park in germany/.PASSAT has many electrical deffects and suspension problems :help: .many of the problems are common with SKODA and AUDI.and their rough TDI engines <_< --no comparison with D4-D :D ;) .

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Naturally I think most of us here, are here because we are fairly enthusiastic about Toyotas. So I suppose we are going to support the whole Toyota thing, and stick up for them.

I too am here because I like them, so will probably remain that way. But I must admit, one of the main reasons I like mine is because all I do is give it petrol, Oil and routine servicing and that's it. Turn the key and go sort of thing.

But yes mine has an older engine, and yes there has always been a bit of a grey cloud over the VVTi engines. So i'm not sure wether i'd have on myself.

You have to make your own choice at the end of the day, and what better way to make it than listening to people with experience. And using a car as a taxi is probably the worst way to use it, so you need a car that will stand up to it.

All the best either way, and I hope you don't stay away from Toyota forever.

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My final thoughts on this subject.............

Toyota's up until early 90's we built in Japan by workers who have the philosophy of "Live to work". Toyota then decided to set up facilities in Europe due to capacity constraints in Japan.

Having been to Japan & worked in 2 of the Toyota plants, it does encourage you to buy Toyota due to the attention they instill into their production systems.

I also helped set-up Carina E production at Burnaston using the Toyota Production Systems & techniques.

Since this time though there has been some major investment in European sites by Toyota. So now most of the cars we own & drive are produced in Europe.

This I believe is the reason the quality/reliability is not what it was, however, being built in Europe has now aligned Toyota with your VW's, BMW's, Ford, etc etc by using European workers.

These European workers are the opposite to the Japanese. Europeans " Work to Live", totally the opposite to the Japs.

One advantage Toyota have over other European Manufacturers is TPS. All Manufacturers strive to emulate this, because it is the best System in the World. European Toyota workers follow TPS discipline which results in better cars than their Competitors.

So what I'm trying to say is. No - European Toyota's are not as good as the ones out of Japan, but they are still better the most European Manufacturers due to TPS. This is why I will always buy/own a Toyota.

:thumbsup:

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I think that's fair comment. I've now got a Japanese Toyota and the quality difference is noticable, which annoys me with european Toyota's that they are not as good, although there is good news on the horizon at least, last week the head of Toyota put out a statement saying that they are initiating a 'back to basics' plan to improve the quality of their cars which he feels may suffer as production increases, so at least they are trying to work on the problem.

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Too much looking the other way, that'll do, what difference does it make? from the people on the floor and too much 'shut up and do as your told, we don't actually want to hear your production problems or suggestions for improvement even though our company values say we do' from the management. So much negativity and no pride.

Despite the new ideals bandied about, attitdudes are slow to change. If the design is good and the machinery is good, the people ar the only variable left. Kind of shows what we know about ourselves as a nation if we'd rather drive cars made by someone else.

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I do admire the Top men at Toyota regarding their honesty & will to speak out when they are not happy about their products.

They regard Toyota as a FAMILY business & will always strive to deliver high quality products at an affordable price.

As Stuart mentioned earlier, Ford, VW, Vauxhall, to name a few are trying to adopt TPS but are failing miserably. For me, this is down to European workers reluctance to change/adopt best working practices. This is why European cars will always be inferior to Japanese. European Toyota's will be better than most of the others though..........

:thumbsup:

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I've just upgraded from a 1.4 vvt-i gls corolla, after having the engine replaced due to high Oil useage, the new engine then failed 2000 miles later the camshaft key failed dropping the valves on the pistons. Once i got back home from work that night i was mind set on getting a civic or golf but thinking back to my days at skoda i droped the golf idea. Once the red mist cleared tho i got my love of the toyota brand back and have always said i'd stay loyal with toyota threw thick and thin so i got me a 54 plate avensis and i must say i've made the right choice. What i'm saying is all manufactures have faults for which they are known but with toyota it seems to be the same things going wrong not a vast arrey of problems.

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Hello all,

I'm new to this forum. I'm a refugee from Saab. I had 5 of the older models one after the other (900, 9000 etc) taking them to up to 150K+ without replacing anything other than service items. However my latest one (a 9-5) was a nightmare. As a marque they are a part of GM now - everyone is convinced this is where the problem lies. They have a list of around 10 major components that fail regularly - seized bottom ends, turbos, reverse gears going, rear shocks, failed driver display units, failed coil packs, disintegrating cats- the list goes on.

Coming onto this forum (1.8 Oil usage aside), for me it's encouraging to see the relatively low number of known issues compared to a lot of brands.

Have a look at some of the forums - Focus ST170 and Porsche related ones are unreal with the list of known issues.

So touch wood I'll have bit more luck with this than the Saab. If it's half as good as the MK1 MR2 I had years ago, I'll be very happy.....

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  • 2 weeks later...

Does anyone know whether all 1.8 vvtis (mine is a 2002) suffer from the oil problem? Or is it pot luck?

It really hasnt much to do with "vvti", but zz series engines - 1.4, 1.6, 1.8. Toyota applied several fixes from 2002 to 2005 in order to reduce the Oil consumption issue. We mostly work with never models, so we never had one in for failure yet. As much as I remember from reading around the net, mid/late 2002 and after cars really didnt have many issues.

as to the avensis's being built in uk having more issues than japanese toyota's, i dont think that is true. First of all, I find fit and finish better in UK built Corolla's than Japanese built Corolla's. Avensis is pretty good example of well built Toyota. Only problem it had with regards to Europe was the lights issue, which was an supplier problem. Toyota said it will increase number of japanese built parts in european factories to improve reliability - as to the fit and finish, UK factory has been good.

French Yaris had some fit and finish issues, but has been extremly reliable, and Turkish Verso also has great fit and finish. As much as i was able to see, Aygo has best in class fit and finish.

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I'm on my 3rd avensis. In my opinion they keep getting better. I had the Oil burning issue with the facelift version but caught it in time and dealer sorted out under warranty. This new model is a joy to drive.

The only thing I will give VW's TDI over Toyota's D4D is fuel economy. A few lads at work have the TDI engine either in VW or Seat motors and average fuel consumption is a lot less compared to the Avensis D4D. But they all have suffered with the usual VW problems of electrics going in cabin and engine. Some turbo problems also.

Spent 2 weeks on training course in Japan and could not believe their work ethic over there. They work 6 days a week and as much OT as required and generally not getting paid for it. But that's Japanese culture which would never work here in Europe.

Hope you find a motor that works well for you, IMO (biased of course), can't go wrong with the new model Avensis. A lot of taximen use them here in Dublin.

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