HSDish

Prius PHEV Gen 3 vs PHEV Gen 4 vs Gen 4 ?

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We bought an Prius + 2016/17 some weeksa ago and we are pleased with it's comfort and space, suitable for family and wheelchair transports, but it seems like it will consume about the same as our second car (Auris TS HSD 2014) so we're now thinkin about to swap our Auris TS HSD for a less fuelconsumptioned car for shorter trips and for one/two person transports.

We have looed at Prius Plug In Gen 3   which seems to be fairly close to the Prius+ in style but consume less  fuel.

so... What's Your opinion/advise

Toyota Pros and cons of  Prius PHEV Gen 3  vs  PHEV Gen 4  vs  ordinary /non PHEV Gen 4 ?

 

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That car (our one/two pers, transporter) is expected to be driven (approximately) 5 km trips, about eight times a week, in small city traffic and some 80 km trips ( each way) of which  50 km at highway speed, about two times a week, all trips without recharging.

We've thought about  - Prius PHEV Gen 3 / Prius PHEV Gen 4 / ordinary Prius Gen 4 or maybe the new Corolla 2019 Hatchback or even Yaris HSD if there is any replacement front seats with lumbar support, avaliable to them.

Youre advises are highly valued

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If you want to save money, just keep the Auris. With such low mileages, I can't see how it could ever make financial sense to change the car. 

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10 minutes ago, Ten Ninety said:

If you want to save money, just keep the Auris. With such low mileages, I can't see how it could ever make financial sense to change the car. 

You probably got an serious point there 🙂 

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I thought about saying that to you yesterday - depreciation on the new car would probably be higher than what you saved in petrol.

 

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I have owned and driven gen 2,3 and 4 ordinaire prius and I now have a gen 4 PHEV Excel

The PHEV is undoubtedly the best of the bunch

It is quieter, the ride is better ,the adaptive cruise control is brilliant the lights are amazing and the best thing of all is the amazing fuel consumption,

I am retired so do not have a regular commute although I do use the car every day and over the last 1500 miles I am averaging 140 mpg. When at home the car is on charge each night for 3+ hours , of the 1500 miles I have done since buying the car  I would say some 600 - 700 have been motorway the rest a mixture of rural and urban journeys but only rarely exceeding the Battery range.

Forget the depreciation factor - there is perverse pleasure in hardly ever visiting the filling station and watching that MPG steadily rising to 199.9 which I did reach at one point.

If your lifestyle mirrors mine and you drive with a a feather on your right foot you won't regret getting a phev 4th gen

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14 hours ago, Nickems said:

I have owned and driven gen 2,3 and 4 ordinaire prius and I now have a gen 4 PHEV Excel

The PHEV is undoubtedly the best of the bunch

It is quieter, the ride is better ,the adaptive cruise control is brilliant the lights are amazing and the best thing of all is the amazing fuel consumption,

I am retired so do not have a regular commute although I do use the car every day and over the last 1500 miles I am averaging 140 mpg. When at home the car is on charge each night for 3+ hours , of the 1500 miles I have done since buying the car  I would say some 600 - 700 have been motorway the rest a mixture of rural and urban journeys but only rarely exceeding the battery range.

Forget the depreciation factor - there is perverse pleasure in hardly ever visiting the filling station and watching that MPG steadily rising to 199.9 which I did reach at one point.

If your lifestyle mirrors mine and you drive with a a feather on your right foot you won't regret getting a phev 4th gen

Thanks a lot for charing Your experiences. Exactly what I was hoping for.

Think I have to re think this again.

I know a man here who drives his Gen 3 PHEV on 115 mpg average mixed, on year/all seasons basis, driving ( and here is below zero degres and snow some days in the whinter) 

 

Still think that ceeping our Auris is the most economocal alternative (guess I'll have to drive a , at lesat Gen 3, for about ten years before it equals the difference in prise) but still, it would be verry nice to manage driving all those short trip on EV only and I think a PHEV (or even ordinary Gen 4 ) will bring in more money than the Auris if I want to sell later on

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On 12/31/2018 at 9:40 PM, Nickems said:

I have owned and driven gen 2,3 and 4 ordinaire prius and I now have a gen 4 PHEV Excel

 

Did/do You experience any differences in access/availability and comfort , when entering the front seat(s) in Gen 3 and Gen 4? (I believe that Gen 3 is a bit higher than Gen 4)

I got some problem with my back/spine and I think our Auris TS HSD 2014 is a little bit to low , which has been much more apparent since we bought our Prius +.

 

 

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2 hours ago, HSDish said:

Did/do You experience any differences in access/availability and comfort , when entering the front seat(s) in Gen 3 and Gen 4? (I believe that Gen 3 is a bit higher than Gen 4)

I got some problem with my back/spine and I think our Auris TS HSD 2014 is a little bit to low , which has been much more apparent since we bought our Prius +.

 

 

Yes, I know exactly what you mean.  The Gen 4 is a bit too low for comfortable entry/exit for the less agile, and I suspect it hasn't helped a hip problem that I've developed since I got my Gen 4.  I find it helps a bit to have the seat almost as high as it will go, the highest setting being too high for comfort,

That said, once inside, the seating is very comfortable, the best since the Gen 1 Prius which had the most comfortable seats and cost comfortable suspension of the four Prius Generations (Gen 2 worst, but still good).  That was at the other end of the scale with quite high seats, and somewhere in the original adverting was a diagram of a person's silhouette getting into the seat showing it made it an easier manoeuvre than cars with lower seats (like Gen 3 & 4 Prius!).

The Gen 3 was still a bit low for comfort, but not a bad as the Gen 4.

For me though, the features of the Gen 4 Prius (ordinaire) still win me over, it's not just the best Prius I've owned (had all fours generations, over 310,000 miles combined), in my opinion it's the best car I've driven.  The only other downsides for me are the auto headlights (not dip) that can't be disabled, reduced interior storage, no under boot storage, and compromised rear head room. But the list of things I love about it is exhaustive.

Personally, I wouldn't consider the plug-in, much as it would suit my driving profile, because I'm not prepared to compromise on a spare wheel and rear wiper (despite it not being ideally positioned for right hand drive cars), but we all have different priorities.

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18 minutes ago, PeteB said:

Yes, I know exactly what you mean.  The Gen 4 is a bit too low for comfortable entry/exit for the less agile, and I suspect it hasn't helped a hip problem that I've developed since I got my Gen 4.  I find it helps a bit to have the seat almost as high as it will go, the highest setting being too high for comfort,

That said, once inside, the seating is very comfortable, the best since the Gen 1 Prius which had the most comfortable seats and cost comfortable suspension of the four Prius Generations (Gen 2 worst, but still good).  That was at the other end of the scale with quite high seats, and somewhere in the original adverting was a diagram of a person's silhouette getting into the seat showing it made it an easier manoeuvre than cars with lower seats (like Gen 3 & 4 Prius!).

The Gen 3 was still a bit low for comfort, but not a bad as the Gen 4.

For me though, the features of the Gen 4 Prius (ordinaire) still win me over, it's not just the best Prius I've owned (had all fours generations, over 310,000 miles combined), in my opinion it's the best car I've driven.  The only downsides for me are the auto headlights (not dip) that can't be disabled, reduced interior storage, not under boot storage, and compromised rear head room. But the list of things I love about it is exhaustive.

Personally, I wouldn't consider the plug-in, much as it would suit my driving profile, because I'm not prepared to compromise on a spare wheel and rear wiper (despite it not being ideally positioned for right hand drive cars), but we all have different priorities.

Thanks a lot for Your helpfull info.

I've got a lot of thinking, feeling and test to do 🙂

Unfortunately it seems necessary to compromice when it comes to choose car

 

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On 1/4/2019 at 11:56 AM, PeteB said:

Yes, I know exactly what you mean.  The Gen 4 is a bit too low for comfortable entry/exit for the less agile, and I suspect it hasn't helped a hip problem that I've developed since I got my Gen 4.  I find it helps a bit to have the seat almost as high as it will go, the highest setting being too high for comfort,

That said, once inside, the seating is very comfortable, the best since the Gen 1 Prius which had the most comfortable seats and cost comfortable suspension of the four Prius Generations (Gen 2 worst, but still good).  That was at the other end of the scale with quite high seats, and somewhere in the original adverting was a diagram of a person's silhouette getting into the seat showing it made it an easier manoeuvre than cars with lower seats (like Gen 3 & 4 Prius!).

The Gen 3 was still a bit low for comfort, but not a bad as the Gen 4.

For me though, the features of the Gen 4 Prius (ordinaire) still win me over, it's not just the best Prius I've owned (had all fours generations, over 310,000 miles combined), in my opinion it's the best car I've driven.  The only other downsides for me are the auto headlights (not dip) that can't be disabled, reduced interior storage, no under boot storage, and compromised rear head room. But the list of things I love about it is exhaustive.

Personally, I wouldn't consider the plug-in, much as it would suit my driving profile, because I'm not prepared to compromise on a spare wheel and rear wiper (despite it not being ideally positioned for right hand drive cars), but we all have different priorities.

I'm still thinking about this matter , to swap our Auris TS HSD for an, even more fuel efficent Toyota HSD/PHEV  and preferably one that's easier to enter/exit front seats (than our Auris).

I havent had the opportunity to test an Prius Gen 3 yet, Since there isn't any Gen 3 nearby, but...

I've read that Prius plug in gen 3 is 20 mm higher than Prius gen 4 and 30 mm higher than our Auris (though I think that theres more things that effect comfortable enter/exit than just measurable hight) and I dont know if there is enough differens (Auris/Prius gen3) to justify a swap. But... Your oppinion is that gen 3 has slightly better enter/exit comfort than gen4 ,as far as I can understad.

Furthermore the Prius Gen 3 looks quite similar in design ( steering wheel, parking brake, instrumentpanel etc) as our Prius+ ,which could be nice and "feel home" when we switch betwen cars.

On the other side our Auris TS has more rear headroom and boot storage than both gen 3 and 4 Prius, I think. But we will priority enter/exit comfort as well as less fuel comsumption

Do You know if the boot space is the same in Prius gen 3 and 4?

 

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44 minutes ago, HSDish said:

...Your opinion is that gen 3 has slightly better enter/exit comfort than gen4 ,as far as I can understand.

Furthermore the Prius Gen 3 looks quite similar in design ( steering wheel, parking brake, instrument panel etc) as our Prius+ ,which could be nice and "feel home" when we switch between cars.

On the other side our Auris TS has more rear headroom and boot storage than both gen 3 and 4 Prius, I think. But we will priority enter/exit comfort as well as less fuel consumption

Do You know if the boot space is the same in Prius gen 3 and 4?

  1. Yes, I felt that the Gen 3 was easier (according to the brochure Gen 3 ground clearance was 5.3" and Gen 4 5.1" - but of course that's not the whole story).
     
  2. I think the general setup in the Gen 3 will feel very familiar (plus you get more space in the front armrest box)
     
  3. The Auris TS will beat the Gen 4 Prius on rear headroom, not so sure about headroom - I could sit in the back of my Gen 3 ok but not the Gen 4. (both versions of the Prius beat the TS on rear legroom though)
     
  4. The boot is similar on the Gen 3 & 4 Prius - although in the latter the cars with a spare wheel will have slightly less than those without, and the Gen 4 lacks the underfloor space then Gen 3 had.
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On 2/17/2019 at 11:24 PM, PeteB said:
  1. Yes, I felt that the Gen 3 was easier (according to the brochure Gen 3 ground clearance was 5.3" and Gen 4 5.1" - but of course that's not the whole story).
     
  2. I think the general setup in the Gen 3 will feel very familiar (plus you get more space in the front armrest box)
     
  3. The Auris TS will beat the Gen 4 Prius on rear headroom, not so sure about headroom - I could sit in the back of my Gen 3 ok but not the Gen 4. (both versions of the Prius beat the TS on rear legroom though)
     
  4. The boot is similar on the Gen 3 & 4 Prius - although in the latter the cars with a spare wheel will have slightly less than those without, and the Gen 4 lacks the underfloor space then Gen 3 had.

Thanks a lot, again.

Will try to test an Gen 3 PHEV as soon as possible

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On 2/17/2019 at 11:24 PM, PeteB said:
  1. Yes, I felt that the Gen 3 was easier (according to the brochure Gen 3 ground clearance was 5.3" and Gen 4 5.1" - but of course that's not the whole story).
     
  2. I think the general setup in the Gen 3 will feel very familiar (plus you get more space in the front armrest box)
     
  3. The Auris TS will beat the Gen 4 Prius on rear headroom, not so sure about headroom - I could sit in the back of my Gen 3 ok but not the Gen 4. (both versions of the Prius beat the TS on rear legroom though)
     
  4. The boot is similar on the Gen 3 & 4 Prius - although in the latter the cars with a spare wheel will have slightly less than those without, and the Gen 4 lacks the underfloor space then Gen 3 had.

Now there's an GEN 3 PHEV 2014 executive for sale at Toyota som 80 km from here. 

Will try to test it on sathurday.

Do you know if Gen 3 PHEV got the same seat heater control and if it's located as far away as in my Prius+  2016/17?

(thats my main complain in Prius +)

I've tried to easen the "hard to handle" seat heater control/button as link below and it works fairly good but I realy would like to be able to move and change the control/button if possible

 

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6 hours ago, HSDish said:

...Do you know if Gen 3 PHEV got the same seat heater control and if it's located as far away as in my Prius+  2016/17?

Sorry, I've only driven the PHEV based on the Prius Gen 3 once, and can't remember where the switches were.

I owned a Gen 3 non-plugin Prius, which didn't come with heated seats, although I had the dealer fit the Toyota accessory seat heaters.  The switch (same type as in your photo) was located in an awkward position under the so called 'flying bridge' part of the centre console, and wasn't easy to reach.  The PHEV might be different, I do recall (I think!) it had a separate switch of left and right seats, and they had 2 heat settings.

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So, a Gen3 ground clearance is .2" better then a Gen4. Does that really mean anything, .2". That can easily be nullified by possible seat height from manufacturer, and certainly by preferred seat height by the driver.

And regarding rear seat headroom Gen3 compared to Gen4, I am 6 foot, with 29 inside leg, meaning my torso to top of head must be a lot. I can sit in the rear of my Gen4 and not touch the roof with clear space as well.

My trouble, when I sat in the back I cannot reach the steering wheel nor pedals. 😂

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All I can tell you is on my Gen 3 Prius I could get in and out more easily, with the driver's seat as high as the roof would allow for my particular size.  I could also sit comfortably in the back (and occasionally did).

On the Gen 4 with the driver's seat as high as I can comfortably sit, I find it much harder (and painful) to get in and out, and my hip problems only started after I got the Gen 4.  The roof starts sloping downwards nearer the front on the Gen 4, and I cannot sit comfortably in the back, in fact my head has to tilt to the side, and is still touching the roof.

I'm only 5' 10½" (27" leg), but padded with it.  My salesman is about an inch taller and much slimmer than me, and he was able to sit in the back just ok, but I doubt he would be happy being driven at speed on an undulating road!

Interestingly (well, to me anyway), when I had a Gen 1 Prius the seats were really high, on at the time somewhere in the marketing material was a diagram showing how this made entry and exit more comfortable than cars with lower seats.  The Gen 2 was fine in this respect too, and both Gen 1 & 2 were fine in the back, though the former had much less legroom, being a segment smaller than subsequent generations.

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14 hours ago, PeteB said:

Sorry, I've only driven the PHEV based on the Prius Gen 3 once, and can't remember where the switches were.

I owned a Gen 3 non-plugin Prius, which didn't come with heated seats, although I had the dealer fit the Toyota accessory seat heaters.  The switch (same type as in your photo) was located in an awkward position under the so called 'flying bridge' part of the centre console, and wasn't easy to reach.  The PHEV might be different, I do recall (I think!) it had a separate switch of left and right seats, and they had 2 heat settings.

That sounds the same as my Plug-in - the switches are under the centre console, but the 12V socket is in-between the two. They require reaching a bit but it's never been a big issue for me.

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2 hours ago, PeteB said:

All I can tell you is on my Gen 3 Prius I could get in and out more easily, with the driver's seat as high as the roof would allow for my particular size.  I could also sit comfortably in the back (and occasionally did).

On the Gen 4 with the driver's seat as high as I can comfortably sit, I find it much harder (and painful) to get in and out, and my hip problems only started after I got the Gen 4.  The roof starts sloping downwards nearer the front on the Gen 4, and I cannot sit comfortably in the back, in fact my head has to tilt to the side, and is still touching the roof.

I'm only 5' 10½" (27" leg), but padded with it.  My salesman is about an inch taller and much slimmer than me, and he was able to sit in the back just ok, but I doubt he would be happy being driven at speed on an undulating road!

Interestingly (well, to me anyway), when I had a Gen 1 Prius the seats were really high, on at the time somewhere in the marketing material was a diagram showing how this made entry and exit more comfortable than cars with lower seats.  The Gen 2 was fine in this respect too, and both Gen 1 & 2 were fine in the back, though the former had much less legroom, being a segment smaller than subsequent generations.

Interesting you mention hip problems.  Back in 2015 I bought a Hyundai i30, nice car. However I found that after driving just a 20 mile journey my right hip was killing me. Didnt matter where I put the seat height, nor back or forward, nor alter the steering wheel up/down/in/out, nor the use of a cushion did anything to alleviate it. After 6 months I had to sell the car, bought a Nissan Qashqui and everything was ok, no problem at all.   So when I was buying my first hybrid, the Auris that the wife now has, which is lot lower then the Qashqui, I made sure I went on a long test run, must have been 25 mile or more.  That was no problem at all.  Neither was the Gen3 Prius nor the Gen4 Prius I got now. I done long trips in both and no problem.  Shame about the i30 but it al least taught me to have a decent test drive and not "just around the block" type of test. 

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To be fair, once inside both generations I am very comfortable. It's only getting into or out of the Gen 4 that gives me problems.

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1 hour ago, Catlover said:

Interesting you mention hip problems.  Back in 2015 I bought a Hyundai i30, nice car. However I found that after driving just a 20 mile journey my right hip was killing me...After 6 months I had to sell the car, bought a Nissan Qashqui and everything was ok...

I'm going on a test drive in the new RAV4 Hybrid on Saturday to see how that feels.  I've got a 2 hour demo, with the option of a longer one later on if I'm still interested.

Apart from being much higher, it has a few features that appeal, such as an electrically operated driver's seat with 2 memories, so if need be I can set one memory to an ideal driving position and the other to an ideal entry/exit position.

My hip problems didn't start until I'd had the Gen 4 Prius for a year or so, and of course it may be coincidence and have to bearing on the issues.  But I did quickly notice the loweer driving position made getting in and out more of a chore, and these days more painful too.

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Is it possible to drive Prius gen 3 PHEV in EV mode direct from (cold) start if the Battery is full loaded or does the petrol enigine kicks in until the cabin is heated?

(my main goal with PHEV is to be able to drive short trips, about 10km on EV from start)

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On 3/30/2019 at 7:57 PM, HSDish said:

Is it possible to drive Prius gen 3 PHEV in EV mode direct from (cold) start if the battery is full loaded or does the petrol enigine kicks in until the cabin is heated?

(my main goal with PHEV is to be able to drive short trips, about 10km on EV from start)

Read the "PHEV" topic and my conclusion from that is, that Prius PHEV gen 3 (or first gen of PHEV) wont be able to (cold) start and be driven directly on EV (petrol engine will kick in to warm up/heaten the cabin. but...   it seems to me that Prius gen 4 PHEV (second gen PHEV) possibly can be driven in EV mode direct from (cold) start if the Battery is full loaded. without kickin the petrol engine, cause of gen 4 s heat pump.

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On 3/30/2019 at 6:57 PM, HSDish said:

Is it possible to drive Prius gen 3 PHEV in EV mode direct from (cold) start if the battery is full loaded or does the petrol enigine kicks in until the cabin is heated?

(my main goal with PHEV is to be able to drive short trips, about 10km on EV from start)

Gen 4 PHEV starts by default in EV mode. The ICE mostly, but not always, starts if you set demist mode, but not otherwise. I have usually got around 20 miles without the ICE starting when it is cold. On warmer days, this has gone over 30 miles. I never switch the aircon off, and usually have the temperature set to 21°C. I'm sure that the range could be improved, but I value my comfort too much.

I don't think the same applies to the Gen 3 PHEV, as I think that requires the ICE for heating.

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On 3/30/2019 at 6:57 PM, HSDish said:

Is it possible to drive Prius gen 3 PHEV in EV mode direct from (cold) start if the battery is full loaded or does the petrol enigine kicks in until the cabin is heated?

It will start in EV mode whenever there is sufficient charge. However, if you left the climate control on when you last turned off the car, and the temperature is set in a way that requires heat, the ICE will start.

If you want no ICE, you need to start the car with the climate control already off. You can potentially do this by going into accessory mode before "Ready" mode, if you forget to turn it off after your last journey.

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