Piggy Back Ecu Chip

[terry steward]

hi there, i have a mk111 91 turbo, i have had quite a number of mods done, and i need to get my hks f con pfc to run, when plugged in, it just dies, but there was the 550 chip provided with it, for the bigger injectors /afm mod, and i believe this needs to be soldered to my ecu, which hopefully will at least give a usable base for a re map, without the hks, my car runs for normal poodling about, but when i try to accelerate, it just holds back and seems to choke up,it was running ok , but was a little lean on idle, but since the spearco intercooler,bigger turbo elbow, k&n fipk, and erl water injection was fitted, it just doesnt want to know, it looks obviously that its getting too much air, so if anyone can advise, and know of someone in essex who can solder this chip in,i would be grateful, thanks, terry

[Karma Supra]

The HKS F con should have a loom and should wire right in, no soldering required! Are you sure it all works properly or is installed properly? Have you found anywhere that can map it???

What is your full list of engine mods to date? Was the engine "in good tune" before you started?

I assume you have checked for air leaks??? I also assume you have remove both cats?

The most "cost effective" route of running 550s properly I have found is jsut get the 550s and an apexi SAFC-II, and get it set up properly on a wide band.

[terry steward]

The HKS F con should have a loom and should wire right in, no soldering required! Are you sure it all works properly or is installed properly? Have you found anywhere that can map it???

What is your full list of engine mods to date? Was the engine "in good tune" before you started?

I assume you have checked for air leaks??? I also assume you have remove both cats?

The most "cost effective" route of running 550s properly I have found is jsut get the 550s and an apexi SAFC-II, and get it set up properly on a wide band.

[terry steward]

The HKS F con should have a loom and should wire right in, no soldering required! Are you sure it all works properly or is installed properly? Have you found anywhere that can map it???

What is your full list of engine mods to date? Was the engine "in good tune" before you started?

I assume you have checked for air leaks??? I also assume you have remove both cats?

The most "cost effective" route of running 550s properly I have found is jsut get the 550s and an apexi SAFC-II, and get it set up properly on a wide band.

hi there, thanks for replying, so far over the last two years, i had the engine completly rebuilt, overbored so i suppose its something like 3.05 litre,i had an hks mhg, new oil cooler, rad,mongoose exhaust, rebuilt turbo,and saab bov, and i shimmed the wastegate, about a year later, lexus afm/550,s, k&n drop in filter, fse power boost afpr, last april, i unfortunatly blew the turbo !! so had it rebuilt with an upgrade stage 2 i think,they removed the shims, as they suggested that may have caused the turbo to blow ??!, the car was running well now, quite fast, but i still had plans !!, i had to have a leaky fuel tank changed in september, so i had an upgraded fuel pump installed, which brings us to this last set of mods, remember the car was running fine, ive just had an mot and service, adding rotor discs and ebc redstuff,magnecor kv85 leads, ngk Iridium up 1 stage plugs, a trd oil cooler, lipp turbo elbow, spearco intercooler kit, (no upper hard pipe so saab bov still in place until i can fit ssqv) i had an aquamist water spray installed, and apart from the ssqv, the other 2 items not yet fitted, was ss auto chrome manifold,that i didnt realise requires different turbo and loads of pipework/ancillaries changed, and lastly the hks f con fpc and fcd, although the lexus afm sorts the fuel cut to about 19 psi, i run 15/16psi, there is a 550 piggy back rom for the larger injectors i have fitted with the afm, but i dont know if thats needed, as they should balance each other out as far as the ecu is concerned, but all i know is now i have no acceleration as it just dont seem to advance the timing or something !!??? hope you can shed some light ta terry

[adi]

youneed to go and ask all this on www.forum.mkiiisupra.net

Its not very often i give links to the owners club on here, but in your case i think you need it.

[terry steward]

youneed to go and ask all this on www.forum.mkiiisupra.net

Its not very often i give links to the owners club on here, but in your case i think you need it.

thanks adi, i took karma supras advice, and checked for leaks, i found the jubilee clip holding the pipe going to the bov was loose, and by now the bov had worked its way off !!!!!, so the turbo was spooling up for nothing !!, i reconnected, and what a difference as you can imagine, there is a problem still however, when i lift my foot off, some times there is a cough of some sort, not the same as fuel cut,there is a strange noise that accompanys it,i dont know whether its that the bov (from a saab) is man enough, i have an ssqv to go on, im just waiting for the pipework to be sorted, as i need to replace my upper ic pipework, the spearco kit didnt include it. the car is going in to tdi on monday for the hks f con to be put on the car and re mapped, hopefully they can advise me of the next step, to iron out the problems. thanks terry

[Karma Supra]

Glad to be of service ;)

Is the splutter just after lifting off after a fairly hard boost???? does it lurch a bit and make a kinda "thut thut" noise, sometimes accompanied with a pop???

If so I'd say its over fueling on over run...

Mine does it to a small extent (Although I thought it was mainly caused my the atmospheric BOV which is alsoa ssbv). its slightly annoying, but I take comfort in the fact that the phut phut pop noises are the flames comming out the tail pipe

There is no better way to show your disaproval at middle lane sitters

[adi]

from memory the saab BOV's dont hold up well at the higher boosts.. but i'm not 100% sure..

[Ahhhh__Aristo]

When you lift off under boost, do you get a noise like a rattle snake under the bonnet??

The Saab BOV's are a good replacement for stock, as they're easily available, I wouldn't use one with your application though.

Your F-con isn't really needed at the moment, the safc should work things fine, is it connected? (the f-con that is)

[terry steward]

Glad to be of service ;)

Is the splutter just after lifting off after a fairly hard boost???? does it lurch a bit and make a kinda "thut thut" noise, sometimes accompanied with a pop???

If so I'd say its over fueling on over run...

Mine does it to a small extent (Although I thought it was mainly caused my the atmospheric BOV which is alsoa ssbv). its slightly annoying, but I take comfort in the fact that the phut phut pop noises are the flames comming out the tail pipe

There is no better way to show your disaproval at middle lane sitters

[terry steward]

Glad to be of service ;)

Is the splutter just after lifting off after a fairly hard boost???? does it lurch a bit and make a kinda "thut thut" noise, sometimes accompanied with a pop???

If so I'd say its over fueling on over run...

Mine does it to a small extent (Although I thought it was mainly caused my the atmospheric BOV which is alsoa ssbv). its slightly annoying, but I take comfort in the fact that the phut phut pop noises are the flames comming out the tail pipe

There is no better way to show your disaproval at middle lane sitters

i found the noise to be a broken fan cowling !!! when theres unusual noises coming from the engine bay after modifications, i was thinking the worst !!,i went to tdi for the remap, and it is actually running very lean, they couldnt even make it up with the hks f con pfc, it ended up at 17 to 1, and i was told 13 to 1 is what they want to see, as a short measure, i have re fitted my stock afm, it improved things a bit, but, i hit fuel cut, i have now connected the f con, and although a little lean, theres no fuel cut, its not getting hot and causing starting problems, which was another problem the lean running was giving me, i have now located a cheap f con pro, which will get rid of the afm altogether,with the mods i have, tdi reckon i should achieve a possible 450 bhp with the mapping, they quoted about £1800 with pts and labour /rolling rd/mapping inc vat, but i have sourced the pts at a third of what they quoted, so it will be a grand in total !! phew, although i will sell some of my unused mod and stock parts, good job its my only hobby that costs!!, my guitar is doing me proud at the mo !! the afm/550/f con?and k&n panel filter, set up is probably ok, but adding the intercooler k&n fipk, and larger turbo elbow, has increased the airflow, density and boost, outgrowing those parts, so the f con pro is probably neccessary after all, thanks all for your comments, terry

[terry steward]

When you lift off under boost, do you get a noise like a rattle snake under the bonnet??

The Saab BOV's are a good replacement for stock, as they're easily available, I wouldn't use one with your application though.

Your F-con isn't really needed at the moment, the safc should work things fine, is it connected? (the f-con that is)

i have been to mike at nitrous solutions, he has suggested that, neither the saab bov, or my intended hks ssqv copy, will be sufficient, he is looking into some new upper ic pipes, and larger bov, as he said theres a danger of stalling the turbo, if i do get to the theoretical 450bhp that tdi estimate..

The safc that everyone seems to mention, is there a model no in particular? is it blitz, apexi, or hks??,is it fully mappable? cheers terry, by the way i like those aristo,s, my brother in law, has got a jet black with blacked out windows, vertex, with the supra twin turbo engine, he reckons its about 400bhp.it also has the chrome mania vortex wheels on it !! lovely looking car he paid £14k about 2 1/2 years ago.

[K19NE G]

The guy who's fitting my Dastek Unichip is in Witham, Essex. His name is Paul Hills and his details are as follows:

Engine Advantages,

Unit 14 Crittall Road,

Witham,

Essex,

CM8 3DR.

Tel / Fax:

01376 502522

http://www.engine-advantages.co.uk/

He has my chip soldered in, but has to find out more information for my car before he tunes it but he has featured in a lot of magazines and tuned some BIG BHP cars! Hope this helps...

hi there, i have a mk111 91 turbo, i have had quite a number of mods done, and i need to get my hks f con pfc to run, when plugged in, it just dies, but there was the 550 chip provided with it, for the bigger injectors /afm mod, and i believe this needs to be soldered to my ecu, which hopefully will at least give a usable base for a re map, without the hks, my car runs for normal poodling about, but when i try to accelerate, it just holds back and seems to choke up,it was running ok , but was a little lean on idle, but since the spearco intercooler,bigger turbo elbow, k&n fipk, and erl water injection was fitted, it just doesnt want to know, it looks obviously that its getting too much air, so if anyone can advise, and know of someone in essex who can solder this chip in,i would be grateful, thanks, terry

[terry steward]

The HKS F con should have a loom and should wire right in, no soldering required! Are you sure it all works properly or is installed properly? Have you found anywhere that can map it???

What is your full list of engine mods to date? Was the engine "in good tune" before you started?

I assume you have checked for air leaks??? I also assume you have remove both cats?

The most "cost effective" route of running 550s properly I have found is jsut get the 550s and an apexi SAFC-II, and get it set up properly on a wide band.

do you think the safc, will increase the amount of fuel sufficiently for the deficit i have, it is pretty lean, 17 to 1 instead of optimum (im told) 13 to 1, ta terry

The guy who's fitting my Dastek Unichip is in Witham, Essex. His name is Paul Hills and his details are as follows:

Engine Advantages,

Unit 14 Crittall Road,

Witham,

Essex,

CM8 3DR.

Tel / Fax:

01376 502522

http://www.engine-advantages.co.uk/

He has my chip soldered in, but has to find out more information for my car before he tunes it but he has featured in a lot of magazines and tuned some BIG BHP cars! Hope this helps...

hi there, i have a mk111 91 turbo, i have had quite a number of mods done, and i need to get my hks f con pfc to run, when plugged in, it just dies, but there was the 550 chip provided with it, for the bigger injectors /afm mod, and i believe this needs to be soldered to my ecu, which hopefully will at least give a usable base for a re map, without the hks, my car runs for normal poodling about, but when i try to accelerate, it just holds back and seems to choke up,it was running ok , but was a little lean on idle, but since the spearco intercooler,bigger turbo elbow, k&n fipk, and erl water injection was fitted, it just doesnt want to know, it looks obviously that its getting too much air, so if anyone can advise, and know of someone in essex who can solder this chip in,i would be grateful, thanks, terry

[terry steward]

The HKS F con should have a loom and should wire right in, no soldering required! Are you sure it all works properly or is installed properly? Have you found anywhere that can map it???

What is your full list of engine mods to date? Was the engine "in good tune" before you started?

I assume you have checked for air leaks??? I also assume you have remove both cats?

The most "cost effective" route of running 550s properly I have found is jsut get the 550s and an apexi SAFC-II, and get it set up properly on a wide band.

do you think the safc, will increase the amount of fuel sufficiently for the deficit i have, it is pretty lean, 17 to 1 instead of optimum (im told) 13 to 1, ta terry

The guy who's fitting my Dastek Unichip is in Witham, Essex. His name is Paul Hills and his details are as follows:

Engine Advantages,

Unit 14 Crittall Road,

Witham,

Essex,

CM8 3DR.

Tel / Fax:

01376 502522

http://www.engine-advantages.co.uk/

He has my chip soldered in, but has to find out more information for my car before he tunes it but he has featured in a lot of magazines and tuned some BIG BHP cars! Hope this helps...

hi there, i have a mk111 91 turbo, i have had quite a number of mods done, and i need to get my hks f con pfc to run, when plugged in, it just dies, but there was the 550 chip provided with it, for the bigger injectors /afm mod, and i believe this needs to be soldered to my ecu, which hopefully will at least give a usable base for a re map, without the hks, my car runs for normal poodling about, but when i try to accelerate, it just holds back and seems to choke up,it was running ok , but was a little lean on idle, but since the spearco intercooler,bigger turbo elbow, k&n fipk, and erl water injection was fitted, it just doesnt want to know, it looks obviously that its getting too much air, so if anyone can advise, and know of someone in essex who can solder this chip in,i would be grateful, thanks, terry

thanks for that i know witham, i have gigged there many times,i have thought about a dastek myself, but was told that i need the more elaborate f con pro, as it needs a proper mapping, with all the stuff i have put on. but its handy to know of more contacts, i got a guy that was going to solder the chip into my ecu, but couldnt find where it was supposed to go, all the time i was saying to everybody, that i thought it had to go in the f con pfc itself, i then found out from tdi it did indeed go in the f con, they have interchangable roms inside, the unit is universal, the roms are $65, mine has now got the 550 rom/chip in, but there is only 20% plus and minus on the fcon pfc, not enough with the intercooler/k&n fipk upgrade.

[Ahhhh__Aristo]

Sorry Terry, some of your posts are a little hard to read without the sentances being split up.

The safc we normally refer to is the Apexi SAFC.

Lets forget the F-con at the moment.

Can you write me a list of all your mods, at this present time please. On seperate lines like this

mod 1

mod 2

etc

etc

(i'm getting old)

And we'll go from there as someting doesn't seem right. And also list wether fitted or not (you wouldn't believe the amount of people who list mods that aren't fitted and are trying to diagnose a problem lol )

[terry steward]

Sorry Terry, some of your posts are a little hard to read without the sentances being split up.

The safc we normally refer to is the Apexi SAFC.

Lets forget the F-con at the moment.

Can you write me a list of all your mods, at this present time please. On seperate lines like this

mod 1

mod 2

etc

etc

(i'm getting old)

And we'll go from there as someting doesn't seem right. And also list wether fitted or not (you wouldn't believe the amount of people who list mods that aren't fitted and are trying to diagnose a problem lol )

mod 1, i had the engine rebuilt 8000 miles ago, using hks 2.0mm mhg, it was overbored, and had new oil pump and radiator, and various pipes,and a mongoose catless exhaust.

mods round two,lexus afm/55o injectors, fse boost valve, k&n panel filter, and bleed valve to 15psi

mod 3 upgraded my ct26 to stage 2, and had fuel pump upgraded

mods 4 magnecor kv85 plug leads,ngk up a grade Iridium plugs.

mods 5 lipp ported out turbo elbow, spearco intercooler kit, and k&n fipk.

mod 6 hks pfc f con,is on the car, but have put original afm back, as car running lean, hks has an fcd fitted.

other mods waiting, are upgrading the upper ic pipework, as spearco only had lower pipes in kit, and i am deciding on what bov to replace the saab one with, as i dont want to stall the turbo. i also have an ss autochrome exhaust manifold, but it has the flange for a t04 turbo at the moment, and having spent a fortune on upgrading my ct26, mike at nitrous solutions is going to weld a flange so i can use the ct26, but i will also have to alter the ic,and lubrication pipe work, also if i get the f con pro, it does away with the afm, so the pipe work between the k&n and turbo will need to be altered, their will be no accordian hose.

[Ahhhh__Aristo]

Thanks for that, much clearer.

Can't see any reason there for it to be running lean.

Your intercooler and air filter, make no difference to the fuelling.

The Lex afm/550 mod is a widely used method.

I would look at fuel supply, have you had the AFPR set up properly??

[Karma Supra]

By nature, and FCD makes a car run leaner... it works by attenuating the AFM signal (i.e. cutting it off before it reaches a certain point) you should not need an FCD on 550s and a Lex AFM.

Have you tried remoiving all the HKS electronics, and just running the Lex AFM and 550s?

Is the Power boost vavle at all adjustable? What fuel pump is it? Walborough 255lph?

Have you double checked for air leaks?? If air is leaking into the system after the meter it would make the car run lean.

I take it you are not trying to use the Bosch BOV as at atmospheric one are you?

Also, lease get rid of the bleed valve, they are horrid, nasty things!!!!!

I would also not use Iridium plugs if you are running high boost... they don;t disperse heat to well and can increase the chances of Detting.... -especially if you are already running lean!!!!

[Ahhhh__Aristo]

Walborough

Is that some where near Peterborough?? :!Removed!: ;)

I take it you are not trying to use the Bosch BOV as at atmospheric one are you?

Wouldn't make it run lean, would be the opposite at operation time.

Also, lease get rid of the bleed valve, they are horrid, nasty things!!!!!

Agreed, after spending that sort of money, don't cut corners there.

I can't see it making 450bhp with a stage2 hybrid tubby to be honest, TDI do know their stuff though, even if on the expensive side.

As for BOV, go for the HKS SSQV or a Turbo XS RFL, both will handle your boost pressure.

[Karma Supra]

Shaaaaaaaaaaat it!

An open BOV could make idle leaner by sucking air in after the airflow meter ;) the Bosch type stay open at idle as they are designed to be used in recirculating systems, during boost it will close up anyway. I am assuming (hoping!) its is installed properly anyway (as the stock one was)

I run an HKS SSBV on mine seems to handle the boost well.... then again I am only running 12 or so psi, stock injectors, stock afm (sold the 550s, lex afm, vernier cam pulleys and monster T4 hybridised CT26... booooooooh) and if anything its running RICH (the flames that ilumiunate the verges either side of me prove that lol)

Still an FCD will by nature make a car run leaner. Get rid of it lol.

[terry steward]

Thanks for that, much clearer.

Can't see any reason there for it to be running lean.

Your intercooler and air filter, make no difference to the fuelling.

The Lex afm/550 mod is a widely used method.

I would look at fuel supply, have you had the AFPR set up properly??

tdi looked at the fse powerboost valve i have fitted, and said that even turning up the fuel pressure with the lexusafm/550s, it is running very lean,

and then adding the hks, which should up the fuelling, still it is running very lean,

now i even tried refitting the stock afm with the 550,s, its not as lean, but hits fuel cut,

adding the hks,to the stock afm/550,s, its still a little lean,

but the only advantage is that the fcd wired in with the hks pfc f con, sorts the fuel cut.

The hks can only add 20% extra fuel, i see the apexi you recomended can add 50%, so its fairly odds on that may sort it, but with the f con pro, its fully mappable, and can grow with any further mods.

The fuel pump, is also like the afpr, is made by glencoe, and is supposedly good for up to 500bhp, i couldnt get a walbro, at such short notice, i had it fitted when my tank sprung a leak, and had to have another fitted quickly.last summer.

[terry steward]

By nature, and FCD makes a car run leaner... it works by attenuating the AFM signal (i.e. cutting it off before it reaches a certain point) you should not need an FCD on 550s and a Lex AFM.

Have you tried remoiving all the HKS electronics, and just running the Lex AFM and 550s?

Is the Power boost vavle at all adjustable? What fuel pump is it? Walborough 255lph?

Have you double checked for air leaks?? If air is leaking into the system after the meter it would make the car run lean.

I take it you are not trying to use the Bosch BOV as at atmospheric one are you?

Also, lease get rid of the bleed valve, they are horrid, nasty things!!!!!

I would also not use iridium plugs if you are running high boost... they don;t disperse heat to well and can increase the chances of Detting.... -especially if you are already running lean!!!!

the lex afm/550,s, have been in over a year, and were all ok when first installed, i had my ct26 turbo upgraded a couple of months later, and on a recent service/mot. it came to light of the lean running,

I had been having starting problems for quite a while, only when hot, from cold, no problem, thats why i got the f con, it was only by coincidence it had the fcd fitted, as i already knew fuel cut had been eliminated, i believe up to about 20 psi,

I have tried many permeatations, as you can see elsewhere,of lexafm/550,s or stockafm/550,s, both with and without hks, at the mo its running stockafm/550,s and hks, coz fuel cut w/out lexafm

The saab bov is plumbed for recirculating as original, but i have an ssqv to go on, just awaiting upper ic plumbing, and im thinking about a turbosmart bov system, with bigger diameter plumbing, to avoid stalling the turbo.

The reason i had a bleed valve, was that originally i didnt want loads of extra dials and boxes in the cockpit, and this gadget seems well manufactured,and inexpensive, and seems to do the job ok, but since getting further into the tuning than originally planned, i was thinking of a better way, and the chrome manifold has also got provision for an external wastegate.

The Iridium spark plug move, was that everywhere i read, seemed to say that, that was a step forward, they are ngk,s,and are one step away from stock heat range, although i had heard that if the tips were not of the protruding type, that can cause problems, apparently the timing has to be altered to accomodate ??!!, but mine are extruding tip, i also have an aquamist water spray system fitted to help det problems, and was going to run half water half methenol?, also the spearco intercooler runs cooler denser air.

[Karma Supra]

My advice would be, take the HKS sytem out of the loop for now.

there is no wat the car should ahve been running lean just running the lex afm and 550s. there is another underlying problem, trying to mask the sympoms by fitting added management stuff is not fixing it!!!

I would suggest you remove any management changes, remove the bleed valve, just run the injectors and lex afm.

At this point reset the ECU, and check for error codes.

When was the lambda sensor last changed? Untill the engine is running properly in a "basic" factory setup, it should not be modified further!!! You have some nice kit there, no point in throwing it all away because an underlying problem is not treated properly!!!

You say its running lean, how lean, where in the rev range and at what boost????

[Ahhhh__Aristo]

Totally agree with Karma, don't try fudging it by adding electronics, as there is an underlying problem, as the lex/550 mod should run, without anything.

Terry, are you a hands on bloke?? cause it's going to get expensive to have garages to try all this stiff (i'm a tight wad lol)

I've had personal experience with the Turbosmart bov, that'll see you alright, but if you have a HKS SSQV I wouldn't bother changing it.

Whereabouts in the world are you, maybe a couple of us unemployed layabouts on here (you know who you are ;) ) could come and have a look.

Edit----can see your in essex, not too far from me.