Recently Purchased Approved Prius From Toyota

[emphasis303]

Hi guys

I purchased my Approved prius from a Westland Toyota dealership on the 9th of December

Since then Ive had a few problems

Firstly every time I brake at low speeds I hear a grinding sound.

Secondly the parking sensors which the car came with on both front do not work,the front are completly dead and the switch to turn them on has no wires going into it. I have tried checking each one on the back to see if its pulsating but nothing on all of them.

The front tyres only had 2 to 2.5 mm on them which is still in the legal limit but its not exactly far off. The rears have about 3 and 4mm.

I took it down to a local kwik fit which showed me the front pads were worn down badly and all disks were badly corroded.

I contacted the supplying dealership 2 days after I took delivery of the car and they said to take it down to my local dealership, I did this and they told me everything was fine and no problems.

Anyway after forcing my local jemca delership to admit there was a problem they said well yeh all discs and pads should be changed as all discs are corroded and front pads are gone.

So I contacted the sales manager of the supplying dealership who said they wouldnt do anything about the parking sensors as they are non toyota.

I said that it doesnt matter you sold me an approved toyota car.

It was finally agreed that Jemca would change all pads and discs and have a look at the sensors on the 22nd December 2009

The day after the pads and discs were changed I could still hear a grinding sound and the brakes began to squeal.

I rang up Jemca and asked what was changed, the first answer I got was pads and discs I said front and back and this was confirmed, until eventually I was told only the front pads and discs were changed with no work on my rear brakes as originally agreed.

I took it back to Jemca who said that the new squeal could be due the new brakes needing bedding in or most probably the back brakes. They said to come back if it continues as it will probably just need some grease.

Ive tried to contact the supplying dealership again but due to

So at this current time I am still experiencing a grinding sound as well as brake squeal during low level braking. As well as malfunctioning parking sensors.

According to the toyota website it says that "All Toyota Approved vehicles are given a thorough inspection by an approved technician before being sold. If the vehicle is not up to our rigorous standards, your Official Toyota Centre will rectify all faults free of charge"

What Id like to know is does it really matter whether the parking sensors are non toyotas and were fitted by the previous owner? As I did buy an approved car from a Toyota Dealership.

Just to add that I am in London and this dealership is a 250mile round trip away.

It has been hard to get in touch with the sales manager who is dealing with my problems but am hoping after xmas I will be able to.

Thank you very much for your help

[Chris Dance]

That is a bad state of affairs. My experience is that Toyota are usually very helpful but in your case they seem to be the complete opposite. I suggest you contact the UK toyota customer care centre and make your complaints to them. If you get no help, try trading standards. I would write a letter to the dealer you purchased the car from stating what is exactly wrong with the car and what you want them to do to correct the faults. Hope you get it sorted.

[cootuk]

There's also the 30 day no quibble exchange plan as a last resort.

Were the parking sensors listed in the vehicle spec, as you would expect that if they were listed they would have been tested as working.

tbh the tyres should have been a negotiable item that you checked before purchase, though on our recently purchased 2006 T3 it looks like they were changed for new when the car came into stock. Legal limit does sound a bit tight though as you would expect the car to be fit for the next year.

[emphasis303]

Thank for your replies

Im hoping to get through to the sales manager tomorrow and explain to him what the website says about fixing all faults free of charge. I am also going to complain that the tyres were so low. If he doesnt agree to fix the parking sensors and have all noises from the brakes sorted then I will ask to speak to the customer relations executive which according the the toyota customer care charted http://www.toyota.co.uk/bv/1024downloads/C...mer_%20Care.pdf is the next step.. I will also send a letter detailing everything that has happened so far and will contact the motor trade organisation the dealer is a member of.

The problem with the 30 day exchange is the next prius they have is another £3000 more which I dont think is it worth it as the one I bought is a t4 and has factory fit leather seats and is the colour I like. However I am prepared to give it back for a full refund.

Cheers

[Red Yaris 54]

Did you test drive the car prior to purchase?

If not, why not?

If you did test drive it, did you not hear the brake noise then?

The tyre wear should have been spotted before purchase and a new set of tyres negotiated...........as you accepted the tyres, as fitted, you may not now have much leverage to get them replaced.

Toyota Approved Used Car scheme is usually very good at sorting things out but you may be obliged to let the supplying dealer carry out any rectification work as your local dealer will not really bear any responsibility for a vehicle sold by another dealer.

Hope that you get it sorted out to your satisfaction.................keep us informed as to progress!

[reece]

When I buy a second hand car and spend my hard earned money, I will go over the motor with a fine tooth comb. I would do a thorough test drive and test all the knobs and switches.

Brake pads and discs, tyres sensors etc should have been checked by YOU before parting with any money, its not rocket science. A visual inspection will highlight any imperfections. Any faults should have been changed/replaced/repaired subject to doing a deal and used as a bargaining tool.

I can’t see how you have any claim after the event. It’s a case of buyer beware.

[Chris Dance]

Is it true that under the consumer act a product has to be fit for purpose? From what we have been told this vehicle is not fit for purpose and the dealer who sold it is therefore responsible for any repairs or refunds etc.

emphasis as you live in London there is the Three Counties Consumer Radio Programme. It is on from 11am till 1pm most days but not public holidays. This programme would deal with your problem and contact the dealer on your behalf. It is a free service. You must not name the company on air and they will only take your consumer problem on air. They are very good. Check out Three Counties Radio web site look for the consumer programme.

Hope you do get satisfaction in the end.

[s m smith]

When I buy a second hand car and spend my hard earned money, I will go over the motor with a fine tooth comb. I would do a thorough test drive and test all the knobs and switches.

Brake pads and discs, tyres sensors etc should have been checked by YOU before parting with any money, its not rocket science. A visual inspection will highlight any imperfections. Any faults should have been changed/replaced/repaired subject to doing a deal and used as a bargaining tool.

I can’t see how you have any claim after the event. It’s a case of buyer beware.

Yes check the tyres and and anything else you can see, but he has bought an approved Toyota,you expect it to be fit for the purpose it was bought for, some people are not mechanically minded and don't know what to look for when buying a car

[emphasis303]

Thank you very much for your replies

a smith has said, I thought I was buying an approved toyota, after reading everything they promise on their website I was sure that any problems and they would be solved.

The dealer firstly refused to deliver the car as he had already given me a £300 discount on the car ( I wasnt aware I wouldnt qualify for delivery if I was given a discount). As it was only about a 125mile trip and am used to driving long distances I thought why not and at least Ill get to check the car out (so I planned lol)

So i went up there by train, when I was trying to pay, their card machine kept saying declined, so I rang up my bank and they said the money had left my account and should be with them.

So they said there was nothing they could do and id have to go away in a courtesy car and they would deliver the car.

It turned out it was a problem with all their machines as the same thing happened on monday morning with other customers

I must add that when I got up there due to my first train being cancelled( someone jumped onto the track) I arrived hours later than expected with only about 45minutes until the dealership was closing. The deal was somewhat rushed, I was having a look around the car checking for any visible signs of problems but was assured by the sales rep there was nothing wrong it was a perfect car just serviced etc and as I was standing in the forecourt of a Toyota dealership I thought any problems and surely their bound to fix it.

I even asked him about the parking sensors and cruise control etc and he explained to me how the cruise control worked and also that the sensors would beep as I get closer to an object but I never ever imagined they wouldnt work as I had bought cars from private sellers and the sensors have always worked.

Im used to buying cars from private sellers and dealers and every time have been under a car inside the bonnet and had a thorough drive through town and at least an A road. As this was a dealership with an approved car I trusted them. I have learnt my lesson and the next time even if its brand new ill be driving it for a good few miles and doing a multipoint check.

As I said due to the holidays its been tricky to get things sorted properly, but ill be on the phone first thing tomorrow morning and will point out the quote from their website.

If he says the car has to come back to them am I obliged to drive it up and come back or does he have to arrange transport.

Im debating whether I should tell him I will drive the car up if he will sort out a courtesy car back and also deliver it back.

I think this is a fair solution since he doesnt want to cough up to a local dealer.

Btw Reece as I mentioned I did buy an approved toyota from an established dealership and not from a private seller. When you walk into sainburys or tesco and buy a can of baked beans, you expect a can of beans dont you? If it turns out the label says baked beans and youve got pickled onions inside your going to go back to the shop. I went to a toyota dealership I bought an approved toyota which they claim to have been through a thorough check, and if its not been checked and things are wrong they will fix them free of charge. I expected to have gotten what I was paying that little bit extra for. If I didnt have all of these promises and guarantees on the back of my mind when going into the dealership I would have brought a mechanic with me.

Cheers

[emphasis303]

ohhh btw chris dance. Thank you very much for info about the radio show, that is extremely usefull to know for future use and also if I dont get anywhere with the dealership.

Thank you very much

[in_the_no]

x

[emphasis303]

The cheek is ive even got a certificate saying my car passed toyotas inspection which im assuming is the pdi, im guessing this was just signed and put in the handbook without any checks being done. As its dated the day before I went up there. Im seriously doubting whether the tyres would have been worn to 2mm the brakes becoming corroded and grinding and the parking sensors not working all over night. The supplying dealer is closed im guessing until tuesday so am waiting to get on the phone to get the sales manages final word and see whether I need to take it any further. Ill keep you posted

[reece]

By ‘Approved’ does that mean its road worthy and has an MOT? If so then it’s good to go. Even if things like tyres and brakes are near the replacement stage if they are legal then it’s a case of the buyer taking a closer look.

I think you’ve created a complete ball ache for yourself by dealing with a dealer 250 miles away (to save a few quid?) only to fork out the money you’ve just saved with train fares phone calls and unnecessary return journeys.

Its still a case of buyer beware and trust no one when parting with your hard earned cash!

[cootuk]

A lot would depend on whether it has been serviced by that dealership before sale.

When I bought mine they tried to say it needed a service and MOT in March, so part of the bargaining was that they brought it forward.

The service should cover stuff like brakes etc, so that gives you leverage if any faults show up that should have been covered as a service item

and for which they should have borne the cost. Things like brakes should reasonably be expected to last until the next service is due if examined as fit for purpose, or highlighted as needing replacement.

(remember too that the Prius only uses the actual brake at low speed and can build up a bit of rust when stood so sometimes this causes noises. Also the brake discs are thinner than normal cars as there's less normal braking to do so you need people familiar with these wear limits).

You obviously have to give the supplying dealership a chance to fix faults, though in the end you may need to involve Toyota itself to spur them on, or, at worst, the Small Claims Court if you keep the car and have the repairs done elsewhere. Plus you would need to keep any parts for examination to determine if they genuinely did need replacing.

When was the last service done and where? - hopefully you got the service booklet?

[goodison]

you will also find that non toyota accesories are NOT covered

[emphasis303]

I have the service book, apparently it was serviced 1000 miles ago. Isnt the dealership as a certified motor dealer obliged to ensure the car is fit for use. I find it hard to believe fit for use only means that it will pass an mot. I was told by a service rep at jemca that if the car comes with sensors the sensors must work its the law. Reece the dealer is 125 miles away and the car I purchased was at least £2000 cheaper than any of its spec and colour near me, and as it was from a toyota dealership it appealed to me even more.

Goodison when you say non toyota accessories are not covered what do you mean? They are not covered under toyota warranty (I am aware of this) but surely a main dealer has more responsibility than a private dealer. I mean if i purchased this car from cargiant which is one of the biggest car supermarkets and went back with this fault they would have it checked and fixed with no question of whether they were toyota or non toyota. So I dont see why a toyota dealership should try and use their name as an excuse.

[mfs1011]

I'd want a second opinion as to the state of the brakes if Kwik Fit said they needed replacing - if you know what I mean ;)

I too recently bought a Prius in a long distance purchase. Have to say that so far I'm happy and got a bargain compared with local vehicles. There was a mod but we ironed out the problems prior to completion of sale.

Though I didn't do it this time as I was dealing with a Toyota main dealer, the last time I bought a car sight unseen I employed a car checker to go over the car with a fine tooth comb. Its worth a couple of hundred quid and is a good way of providing a gold standard to the state of the car.

It may be worth getting in the RAC or someone who is not out to make a buck to check the car over and provide a written report?

[emphasis303]

Yeh I understand what your saying about kwik fit I know they are just after the money but I saw the state of the front pads there was maybe a mil or two left on them, and the grinding sound was unbearable, im still getting a bit of grinding which can be heard when braking from about 7 miles an hour which is annoying to say the least when stuck in traffic. Exactly as youve said, I too trusted the dealer as it was a toyota main dealer.

[Chris Dance]

I think you should get it sorted eventually but a firm no nonsense letter to Toyota UK may help. I would do this regardless what the dealer comes up with. It may help others purchasing from this dealer in the future. It is a shame all this is going on over a holiday period. As previously said Prius brakes get little use so brakes and pads do not wear very much. Let us know how you go on.

[emphasis303]

I have drafted one as we speak and will get it sent off in the next couple of days. I got delivery of the car on the 9th of December and by the time it was seen by my local dealership it was the 22nd so yes the timing wasnt exactly perfect. Thanks for all the advice I should have an answer tomorrow.

[DONFRAMAC]

Your saving of about £2000 on expected price says a lot. My wife and I bought our Son a 5-year-old IBIZA in May '08, which had been MoT'd in March and advertised in Autotrader, but in the "bargain basement" category. I.E., no 100- point check or 12-month warranty, as a used-approved car is expected to have. No wonder it stayed unsold despite being low-mileage (44,000 M).

They did not advertise that the warranty was only 30 days. Those cars shift fast, so a quick 110 mile trip was made for a test-drive, and check-over. The rear tyres needed replacing, and I wanted a fresh MoT, so a deal was done for £1000 less than a "used-approved" price. However, the MoT (fresh one) revealed one front spring and one front wishbone bushing needing renewal. They refused to fit a pair of both, to match the 2 sides of the car up. Basically, I got milked of £176 for a spring and bush that I have no way of knowing were renewed or not, but it would have covered the tyres and MoT.

The SEAT dealer told us that his trade-ins have to be exceptional, for him to re-sell them himself as "used-approved" as they have to sell fast (metal on the tarmac costs money), so at that price level, the car is off-loaded to a "trader", even prior to the car arriving in stock, at Trade price, and the trader can bull-up the car and wait for a customer, from a fenced compound in an Industrial Estate. ( We had seen 2 of his LEON's 20 miles away, on his recommendation.)

My experience of Toyota Used Approved, is that my Toyota dealer, where my wife and I have bought 5 Toyotas, could not requisition a Toyota Used Approved car I wanted, from a Glasgow Dealer, as he was a Stand-Alone dealer, with no integration in a system. I believe this may be the case in general, except in some groups in common ownership, such as the one in Ireland that folded this year, and another in the midlands that did Toyota and Ford. The latter group had the Ford side bought over, but not the Toyota Franchises. I think that the word FRANCHISE says a lot. Toyota Customer relations dept have a tenuous grasp on dealers, such that a senior executive from Lexus has been drafted in, to try to improve things.

Our dealer has improved since we started buying there, but 100 miles away, where our Son lives, there are unhappy owners.

(VAG group are no more consistent, and are actively trying to prevent car owners going to another type of VAG outlet for parts/maintenance)

My Son had poor maintenance done on his SEAT, that was eventually resolved by the intervention of the After-sales Manager, very amicably. I have heard of other cases where the Dealer-Principal at the dealership has considerable clout in thorny situations like yours, and tries to maintain calm and sensibility.

[emphasis303]

I guess it doesnt matter what manufacturer you use its down to the type of staff working at the dealership. My problem is that they are not round the corner, but if he will accept to repair all faults if I bring it down and provide me with a courtesy car to go back with and then redeliver the car than I will be somewhat pleased.

[Parts-King]

This is a sad state of affairs, but lets put a few things right first!

Your contract is with the dealer you bought it off, taking it to another dealer to have work sorted out is not the best way to do it. Put EVERYTHING in writing to the centre Principle, AND the sales manager, send it recorded delvery and tell them what you expect to be done, give them a reasonable timeframe, and tell them what will happen if the car is not put right (Reject the car or whatever you feel is right for you)

The sale of goods act can be complicated and not always straight forward, however sorting it out now in the first month gives you a lot of choice, here is what the act says

Wherever goods are bought they must "conform to contract". This means they must be as described, fit for purpose and of satisfactory quality (i.e. not inherently faulty at the time of sale).

• Goods are of satisfactory quality if they reach the standard that a reasonable person would regard as satisfactory, taking into account the price and any description.

• Aspects of quality include fitness for purpose, freedom from minor defects, appearance and finish, durability and safety.

Now I would suggest that "free from minor defects" includes everything on the car, even though second hand, regardless of wheather or not they are Toyota parts or not, you didnt fit parking sensors, the dealer sold them like that, if he said "you buy this car but the sensors dont work and I'm not going to put them right" then he wouldnt have to!

Get writing, do it today and post it ASAP

Kingo

[Chris Dance]

I agree with Parts King. He has summed up what needs to be done very well.

[emphasis303]

Thanks very much for your post, I have a letter ready for the customer relations executive explaining everything that has happened so far and what I want. As the last time I spoke to the sales manager I didnt have any information gathered and the promise from the toyota website as well as information from my local dealer, I thought I would speak to him when hes back in the office on monday, if he refuses to do anything Ill have the letter on the executives desk on tuesday morning.

Im going to update the letter with the information you provided and make sure to mention it on monday.

Thank you very much