12v battery maintenance, issues, etc.

[Chas G]

3 minutes ago, coreye9090 said:

It's only got  "Report" or "Share" option😅

The edit function is on a timer. Edit is only available for about 1/2 hour? after you complete your post

[coreye9090]

1 hour ago, Chas G said:

The edit function is on a timer. Edit is only available for about 1/2 hour? after you complete your post

Ah! Good to know! I had no idea!

[RickyC]

22 hours ago, Cyker said:

You'd have to leave it connected to a trickle charger for the whole 3 years for it to have any chance of surviving. Left unplugged it'd be dead within half a year I reckon - Lead acid batteries generally don't like being left for long periods.

But when you buy a new Battery, it could have slept on the shelf for months...

[Cyker]

I forget what the interval is, but unsold lead acid batteries are supposed to be cycled out for fresh ones every ?month? or so because of that exact problem, at least by reputable motor factors.

We had a guy who thought it would be a good idea to buy a spare lead acid Battery for their UPS system, and left it in the packaging in the store room. About 2 years later, when the Battery in use expired, he went to change it to the 'spare', only to find it had even less capacity than the expired one!

Lead acid batteries need to be kept at or near 100% to minimize the rate they degrade at. If not connected to a trickle charger, they will self-discharge; I forget the rate but IIRC it's lower than NiMH, but higher than e.g. alkaline or lithium batteries.

[FROSTYBALLS]

6 hours ago, Tom Corbett said:

I haven't found the edit button.

Members have a limited time in which to edit posts. 

A moderator, who can edit posts at any time, can be messaged to request a post be edited if desired.

[Derek.w]

I personlly be suprised if any 12 volt Battery survives on the shelf after 3 month without a recharge.

A solar charger may work but you still have to monitor it because around dusk it be a added drain to the Battery remember its rating in watts is for maximum output in direct sunlight.

[Derek.w]

4 hours ago, RickyC said:

But when you buy a new battery, it could have slept on the shelf for months...

Or maybe its then the supplier adds the distilled water gives it a electric charge then fits it or post it to you.

[hind]

8 hours ago, Derek.w said:

then the supplier adds the distilled water

What about the sulphuric acid? What about the batteries without the caps? Seriously a full charge once every 6 months is enough 🙂

[Derek.w]

On 3/13/2024 at 5:17 PM, Dala said:

Yesterday I bought a new Varta 44Ah car battery in a specialist shop for the planned replacement of the existing Turkish Mutlu battery.  The salesman told me that all WET batteries must not drop below 12.4V. The car battery will be in good condition -  must be recharged immediately when the voltage is found to be 12,4V.

If you go down the solar panel route then buy one with a solar charge controller you can then see the voltage and use its 2 usb ports to charge smaller Battery packs like mobile phone for free.

[Derek.w]

15 hours ago, hind said:

What about the sulphuric acid? What about the batteries without the caps? Seriously a full charge once every 6 months is enough 🙂

I am on about who actually commissions the Battery MFG or dealer/trader you purchased it from.

Its not beyond any company filling up a Battery with the correct mixture and appling its first charging then sealing up including sealed lead acid Battery.

[RickyC]

On 3/15/2024 at 11:02 PM, Derek.w said:

Or maybe its then the supplier adds the distilled water gives it a electric charge then fits it or post it to you.

Even if you order on-line, I've seriuos doubts that Battery is filled or recharged before delivery.  

Simply they put a label with your address and load it on van.

The Yuasa or the Varta batteries that can be used as an replacement for the Mutlu are no mainteance ones, factory prefilled with acid an distilled water. 

Probably the Mutlu ones are designed to be filled directly by Toyota directly in the production line.  

[Cyker]

The vast majority of modern lead-acid batteries are sealed and maintenance free - You shouldn't need to add water to them, ever; If you do, the Battery is probably on its way out.

They just need to be kept charged.

If I was buying one from a shop, I wouldn't touch one that was more than a month old, as it would have experienced noticeable degradation if it had been sat there that long with no maintenance charge.

[MariusS]

Dear Hybrid owners I am shock like you when I see the new cars have this type of the issue with the 12 V Battery.
I think on my Yaris Cross Hybrid model 2022 I will add an Smart alarm with turn On Engine from mobile app and on Starline app (just an example what I see with my eyes) I see that I have the option to see the live volts of the 12v Battery so in this case, I can open the engine and recharge the 12v Battery when/if needed. 
This is just a workaround, if you need to invest in a Car Alarm, is better to invest in something good that can avoid also this problems with 12v battery.
I still check the market for the best alarm (to solve the future issue with 12v battery) and if you have any proposal just let me know. 

[Derek.w]

6 hours ago, Cyker said:

The vast majority of modern lead-acid batteries are sealed and maintenance free - You shouldn't need to add water to them, ever; If you do, the battery is probably on its way out.

They just need to be kept charged.

If I was buying one from a shop, I wouldn't touch one that was more than a month old, as it would have experienced noticeable degradation if it had been sat there that long with no maintenance charge.

Cyker You missed the point who added the liquid in the first place for batterys sold from a parts department, or a Battery supplier they dont have hundreds of Battery on charge just to keep them fresh on the shelf.

[Cyker]

It gets added during manufacture at the factory before it's sealed. You certainly wouldn't want some rando try to pour acid into them using a funnel or something later in the process  

 

[Dala]

KONNWEI KW208 Car Battery Load Tester /  CTEK charging

----------------

09/2022

  

------------------

03/2023

  

----------------------

03/2024

  

------------------------

I don't understand how the tester with my Battery still reports: OK - recharge

[hind]

Because it doesn't measure capacity, only SOH based on max current and SOC based on voltage. 

[Dala]

Yes, it's obvious.
It's just a demonstration that the car service will find that everything is OK during the measurement.
They will say that the Battery only needs to be recharged.
But the Battery is already in bad condition and needs to be replaced.
Why else would the charger automatically start the "desulfation" program for a long time?
Three years after buying a new car, the "desulfation" program started at 20 minutes, and now, after 3.5 years, it is already at 4 hours.
I did not register this program on the chart before this time.
I regularly drive 200-500 km/week, CTEK charging 1-2x/month, solar panel charging with regulation regularly in the summer when the car is not driven for more than 1 day.
IMHO it's because the Battery most of the time has a voltage << 12.3V and the sulphation process increases (applies to all modern cars with smart charging).

Even though I did my best, I will change the battery after 3.5 years.

My conclusion:
Desulfation can only help maintain a battery’s condition. In the case of permanent sulfation, the process will improve the battery performance. But, it will not stop sulfation completely.

[Countryside]

Have read alot of complaints about the Battery on Toyota Facebook not starting one poor woman only had her Yaris fully serviced a week before !

[anchorman]

52 minutes ago, Countryside said:

Have read alot of complaints about the battery on Toyota Facebook not starting one poor woman only had her Yaris fully serviced a week before !

It not starting might well be because she’s had it serviced Michael.   If the mechanics were messing with it switch on and off for any reason.  The Mutlu is the weak link in all that but she wouldn’t know.  

[Countryside]

1 hour ago, anchorman said:

It not starting might well be because she’s had it serviced Michael.   If the mechanics were messing with it switch on and off for any reason.  The Mutlu is the weak link in all that but she wouldn’t know.  

That’s right Don they don’t know it’s better with the different battery 

[Derek.w]

On 3/10/2024 at 10:23 AM, MCatPG said:

I assume you connected the CTEC smart charger at about 07:30

And you disconnected it at about 10:40, when there was a blip down to 13.0V followed by recovery to the sort of voltage you'd expect from a fully charged battery, around 13.5V

What happened at 11:00? Was that when you connected the solar panel? The voltage dropped to about 12.5V, then recovered to about 12.7V, and then the continuous discharge kicked in, possibly because there isn't any output from the solar panel.

I suspect that your MPPT controller is getting no energy from the panel, and is actually drawing current from the battery instead of putting it in. This draw should be negligible but if Dala is right (I think he is) and the battery is in very bad condition this would explain why the discharge and consequential reducing voltage is greater after adding the panel than it was before, Sorry if that's a disappointment.

This is todays solar charging starting from around 8:30 so moving in the right direction!.

[Dala]

1 hour ago, Derek.w said:

This is todays solar charging starting from around 8:30 so moving in the right direction!.

Derek,
compared to me, you have a fast ramp-up in volts for the solar panel.
Do you have the panel inside the car or outside in front of the car?

[samo111]

I recently bought a 2015 Yaris with only 35k miles on the clock so it hasn't been driven much by the previous owner. It seems I need to replace the Battery since the car needs a jump start if I don't drive it after a couple of days.  My question is do I need to replace the Battery with the same agm type or can I  buy the Yusua one?

[jthspace]

14 hours ago, samo111 said:

I recently bought a 2015 Yaris with only 35k miles on the clock so it hasn't been driven much by the previous owner. It seems I need to replace the battery since the car needs a jump start if I don't drive it after a couple of days.  My question is do I need to replace the battery with the same agm type or can I  buy the Yusua one?

Yuasa Battery as shown in this thread - direct, same size Battery with some extra power.