12v battery maintenance, issues, etc.

[Derek.w]

20 hours ago, samo111 said:

I recently bought a 2015 Yaris with only 35k miles on the clock so it hasn't been driven much by the previous owner. It seems I need to replace the battery since the car needs a jump start if I don't drive it after a couple of days.  My question is do I need to replace the battery with the same agm type or can I  buy the Yusua one?

Make sure your Battery posts are the right way round for your car and check out the type of Battery fitted then dimentions of Battery.

Some sights work it out for you from your number plate but it still pays to check.

[Derek.w]

Hi Dala The quick ramp up at the start put it down to Battery swaping for giving it a desulphation run but that takes hours so fitting old Mutlu Battery to car first hence a quick startup.

I am using a 30 watt solar panel connected to a MPPT controller all kit is inside car solar is located under front window.

This is todays graph under slightly less sunshine.

MPPT controler uses voltage and current control via a step down buck transformer.

The big downward spike is me just using some power without starting car second spike car starting.

  

[Roy124]

After my tyre change Friday I checked my Battery voltage after getting home - 11.99v.  I put it on charge for 48hrs.  This morning,  24hrs later, pleased to see it sitting at 12.67v.  Note @Derek.w figure above.

[RickyC]

19 hours ago, jthspace said:

Yuasa battery as shown in this thread - direct, same size battery with some extra power.

The Yuasa Battery shown in this thread is good replacement for the factory fitted Mutlu one on Yaris Mk4.

@samo111 has bought a Mk3 Yaris that use a different model of Battery.  Surely there's an Yuasa Battery that fits but it's not the one suggested for mk4 Yaris.

[jthspace]

4 hours ago, RickyC said:

The Yuasa battery shown in this thread is good replacement for the factory fitted Mutlu one on Yaris Mk4.

@samo111 has bought a Mk3 Yaris that use a different model of battery.  Surely there's an Yuasa battery that fits but it's not the one suggested for mk4 Yaris.

Oops, my bad, should have checked the user info! Sorry.

[dash]

I'm just about to buy a '24 Excel (latest version). Anyone know if the 12V Battery has changed from Mutlu to something else?
I do around 100 miles/week on average and sometimes the car sits on the drive for 3 or 4 days.
I'm astounded that Toyota have not fixed this issue (with Battery management software they could ensure automatic charging of the 12V Battery when its SoC/voltage drop below target levels).

[hind]

They didn't change anything but 3-4 days of parking with total of 100 miles a week should be enough to keep the Battery (even from Mutlu) in acceptable charge state.

[Cyker]

Try it first - I reckon the current batch are much fresher and less likely to have problems from the outset. I suspect the people having problems had ones that were sat on a shelf over covid and were already smegged to begin with, but those should have all gone now. I feel like we've not had so many reports of issues from owners of newer ones.

And drive the thing a bit when you pick it up - Don't be like the guy that bought the car, drove home, then immediately went on holiday for some months, and was surprised the Battery had died when they got back!

[Max_Headroom]

Spotted this on Facebook -  

Toyota admit there is a problem with the 12v Battery and offer an enhanced replacement if you agree not to tell anyone you have had one fitted, what a disgrace and i hope Toyota get taken to court over this. 

Toyota Yaris Owners

David Mynors  ·   · 

 

THIS IS A MUST READ FOR ANYONE THAT HAS HAD PROBLEMS WITH A SELF CHARGING YARIS CROSS 12 VOLT Battery

 

We have been in dispute with Jemca Bracknell and Toyota as regards a new Yaris Cross we purchased. We have had Battery problems and are of the opinion that the car is not fit for purpose and in addition we were mis-sold in view of our low mileage requirements.

We have received a buyback offer which we feel is too low. Below is an extract from an email received from Jemca and Toyota. We have been advised that Toyota have introduced an "ENHANCED" battery in an effort to resolve the problems that many are having. There is an offer on the table to fit the enhanced battery to our car, free of charge! You will note the conditions as set out in the email and in particular the replacement battery must be confidential and we must not tell any third parties. From our experience that is not how we would expect a major retailer and manufacturer to conduct business. This smells of sharp practice and clearly they don't want you to know!!!

 

EMAIL FROM JEMCA/TOYOTA

"We are satisfied that our buyback offer is more than reasonable in the circumstances, and we are therefore not prepared to increase it. However, we are still willing for our goodwill offer as per the terms set out in my email dated 26th March to remain available for acceptance until 4pm on 28th March.

Alternatively, we offer as a goodwill gesture to fit the enhanced battery at no cost to you on the basis that you keep the vehicle. This offer is on the basis of no admission of liability and in full and final settlement of the issues you have raised in respect of the vehicle.

Furthermore, this offer is subject to the terms of settlement and all discussions, negotiations and correspondence concerning the dispute being kept confidential and not referred to any third party whatsoever save as may be required by law."

We would recommend that anybody that has experienced battery issues insist on a replacement with the enhanced battery. Next winter will be the acid test for the new battery. Fingers crossed for you all.

[Parts-King]

A confidential offer put on BookFace, you couldn't make it up 🙄🙄

[Max_Headroom]

8 minutes ago, Parts-King said:

A confidential offer put on BookFace, you couldn't make it up 🙄🙄

Why should the customer  keep quiet?

I am glad the customer decided to expose Toyota for trying to keep the 12v Battery problem quiet instead of  admitting there is a problem and doing the decent thing by replacing all Hybrid batteries with the enhanced Battery.

[FROSTYBALLS]

Presumably as the 'confidential' offer has been posted on social media, and is no longer confidential, the offer was no longer valid. As always, the contract and negotiations/offer are between the customer and the dealer, so excludes the manufacturer. 

One side of the story only.

[Max_Headroom]

The main point for me  is the dealer has admitted they can fit an enhanced Battery if customers do not drive often to solve the now well documented flat Battery problem i wonder how many customers like the ones in this thread who have complained have been offered the same.

Quote

Alternatively, we offer as a goodwill gesture to fit the enhanced battery at no cost to you 

 

[hind]

Dealer doesn't want to pay for the manufacturer issue and that's understandable. They have to strictly follow service procedures to determine if the part should be replaced under warranty (and per manufacturer expense). If they don't, they won't get the refund for it.

[Cyker]

This all because they are trying to make it right without making themselves vulnerable to attack, hence all the disclaimers of guilt etc.

One of the reasons a lot of businesses tend to be so cagey is they are subject to the same "No good deed goes unpunished" effect many of us have no doubt experienced...!

[Max_Headroom]

On 4/3/2024 at 4:56 PM, hind said:

Dealer doesn't want to pay for the manufacturer issue and that's understandable.

Lets get back to the JEMCA/TOYOTA customers complaint - 

Dealers are selling cars to customers knowing full well if they dont drive the car regularly the 12v Battery is going to let them down this is a shoddy practice and it needs to be exposed i couldn't care less if it is the manufacturer of the battery  that is at fault Toyota  should have sorted this as soon as it became an issue instead of carrying on using these batteries in all hybrids,  why didn't they switch to the "enhanced" Battery as soon as it became obvious there was a problem?

[anchorman]

15 hours ago, Max_Headroom said:

 

Lets get back to the JEMCA/TOYOTA customers complaint - 

Dealers are selling cars to customers knowing full well if they dont drive the car regularly the 12v battery is going to let them down this is a shoddy practice and it needs to be exposed i couldn't care less if it is the manufacturer of the battery  that is at fault Toyota  should have sorted this as soon as it became an issue instead of carrying on using these batteries in all hybrids,  why didn't they switch to the "enhanced" battery as soon as it became obvious there was a problem?

It’s not as easy as that.  You can’t just switch when you are in a contractual agreement with a manufacturer and you can’t just switch on an alternative supplier, it needs to be planned.  Furthermore, it isn’t a Jemca Toyota issue, it’s a Jemca issue, the dealer that sold the car.  Typical FB nonsense where s disgruntled owner can’t get his own way and reacts by making it an official announcement when as always the case, the dealer cannot nor will not comment and remain professional.  What we don’t know is what has gone on between them or the condition of the vehicle.  A lot of people treat a vehicle as a tool and rub them up the curb, smoke, vape, trash, never clean them and they’ll expect to get what they’ve paid.  We can’t see any of that and neither can the FB warriors.  The dealer will offer what the car is worth after it’s been repaired.  We know the procedure for changing a Battery, they need it day 1 for charging and day 2 for testing and that’s why I say, for £70-80, just change it and save yourself some hassle.  Personally, I completely ignore that so called FB announcement, if it’s a legitimate case, it’ll turn up on a more reliable platform and I applaud Jemca for their professionalism.  

[Countryside]

17 hours ago, Max_Headroom said:

 

Lets get back to the JEMCA/TOYOTA customers complaint - 

Dealers are selling cars to customers knowing full well if they dont drive the car regularly the 12v battery is going to let them down this is a shoddy practice and it needs to be exposed i couldn't care less if it is the manufacturer of the battery  that is at fault Toyota  should have sorted this as soon as it became an issue instead of carrying on using these batteries in all hybrids,  why didn't they switch to the "enhanced" battery as soon as it became obvious there was a problem?

well said Don 

[FROSTYBALLS]

At the end of the day, Facebook posts are for the members of that particular forum, and aren't relevant to this Club.

[Max_Headroom]

5 minutes ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

At the end of the day, Facebook posts are for the members of that particular forum, and aren't relevant to this Club.

I think that's  very short sighted its Toyota discussion what does it matter where its posted? 

Just to clarify if someone reads something negative about Toyota cars on the internet they cannot post it here?

[FROSTYBALLS]

Just now, Max_Headroom said:

Just to clarify if someone reads something negative about Toyota cars on the internet they cannot post it here?

Obviously that isn't the case.

Copying posts verbatim from other forums, however, isn't relevant to this Club.

Please move on !

[hind]

21 hours ago, Max_Headroom said:

they have an enhanced battery that will sort this problem

They had it for a long time already, manufactured by Yuasa, and they are very aware about the issue. The thing is, they have contracted delivery from Mutlu and for financial reasons they don't want to change it as they probably saved a lot by using cheaper batteries. That's one thing.

The second thing is that dealership is also aware about this but they don't want to change the Battery for free because that's their cost, despite the producer fault. That's why dealerships in Poland wrote to Toyota Europe to change the 12V Battery testing procedure so they can replace the faulty batteries under car warranty. Of course they still have to use official OEM parts which is once again, Mutlu. That is the only thing they can change apart from pressing on the Toyota Europe to change the Battery supplier, but as we can see with MY24 models rolling out, they are still using Mutlus.

So for extra annoyed customers the dealership offers a good will replacement action, for which they pay from their own pocket, assuming that happy customer would return once more. That is why they don't want this to be published. This can cost the dealership a lot of money despite the fact that they didn't do anything wrong (apart from lying to the customers who initially told them about short mileages etc but that's a different story).

If anything has to change (global recall or whatever), dealerships has to stop selling these cars - because customers would pick the different brand, model or just skip 4.th generation of Yaris or YC. 

But this doesn't happen. 

Toyota last year has sold in Poland more than 26000 Yaris and Yaris Cross cars, making this #1 popular model (if you group them, when separated, Yaris is on 3rd place with 13459 sales and Yaris Cross is on 4th place with 13402 sales). You know what that means? Yes, people still buy these cars. And they still would buy them. As long as they would buy them, Toyota would do absolutely nothing about the battery because apparently nobody really cares.

[Max_Headroom]

20 hours ago, hind said:

You know what that means? Yes, people still buy these cars. And they still would buy them. As long as they would buy them, Toyota would do absolutely nothing about the battery because apparently nobody really cares.

Its not that nobody really cares its that they are unaware of this problem when they buy the car, if the sales man/woman pointed out to potential buyers that leaving the car on the drive for days on end would most likely end in a breakdown how many sales do you think they would have lost?

[hind]

10 minutes ago, Max_Headroom said:

for days

As you already saw among answers in your topic 

leaving a car for a week does no harm. And as you also probably noticed, most of the drivers use the car daily or almost daily. In this scenario even Mutlu (in working condition, I'm not talking about half-dead ones) is enough to keep the car running.  

[Parts-King]

The trouble with forums is that you would think this affects every car, I can tell you it doesn't, it mainly affects people doing very low mileage. I have a lady who comes in every single day to see us, then she goes to a garden centre locally and then home, probably does 10 mile a day at most. She has never had an issue, we have very many more customers like that. The issue is being addressed by Toyota, it maybe addressed by a service campaign, it won't be by recall as it is not a safety issue. I don't have any other specific information on the current situation