Hybrid car insurance refusals

[forkingabout]

First generation C-HR have the proven easy CAN invader theft method that certain insurance companies will either load the premium, insist on fitment of a Thatcham approved tracker OR easiest option for the insurance company is refuse to cover them full stop.

When the factory fitted security system can be beaten & vehicle driven away in under 90 seconds, an insurance company would be sensible to just not take on the risk.

[Haliotis]

Instead of annually hitting the drivers with ever increasing premiums, the insurers could better use their time by widely publicising the makes and models of cars which they refuse (or threaten to refuse) to insure.  This could go a long way towards ensuring that manufacturers, vigorously prompted by worried franchises, into forcing the manufacturers to design their vehicles to benefit both the insurers and the insured.  Serious boycott by the insurers and potential car buyers is a certain effect that would make the manufacturers sit up and take note!  Practical design that doesn’t disregard safety and ease of repair/maintenance in order to cheapen the methods of manufacture is something we should all be demanding.

At one time, car makers pooh-poohed the idea of galvanising car bodies, until one maker introduced it along with  substantial anti corrosion warranty, and then survival needs pushed other makers into line.

[forkingabout]

If the thieves can get access to the OBD port the vehicle can still disappear & the manufacturers can do nothing to stop this all thanks to EU anti competition regulations. 

[philip42h]

23 minutes ago, forkingabout said:

If the thieves can get access to the OBD port the vehicle can still disappear & the manufacturers can do nothing to stop this all thanks to EU anti competition regulations. 

That's not true. EU anti competition regulations prevent manufacturers from using proprietary protocols and codes that would prevent third party garages from providing an equivalent level of service as the franchised dealer network. That does not provide carte blanche to bypass the security 'token' held by the vehicle owner. If you take your car to be serviced, you still have to leave the key!

[forkingabout]

4 minutes ago, philip42h said:

That's not true. EU anti competition regulations prevent manufacturers from using proprietary protocols and codes that would prevent third party garages from providing an equivalent level of service as the franchised dealer network. That does not provide carte blanche to bypass the security 'token' held by the vehicle owner. If you take your car to be serviced, you still have to leave the key!

OBD port theft tools for the newer Toyota / Lexus products with the " secure " CAN system already on the dark web, Toyota / Lexus fix the CAN invader method & the thieves turn their attention to the next weak link in the system. 

Manufacturers security token is pretty useless when the OBD port is unlocked for anyone to plug electronic devices in to. 

 

 

[philip42h]

8 minutes ago, forkingabout said:

OBD port theft tools for the newer Toyota / Lexus products with the " secure " CAN system already on the dark web, Toyota / Lexus fix the CAN invader method & the thieves turn their attention to the next weak link in the system. 

Manufacturers security token is pretty useless when the OBD port is unlocked for anyone to plug electronic devices in to. 

That may be true, but it's not a consequence of EU anti competition regulations ...

[O.W.L.]

Land Rover Jaguar are having even bigger problems with this at the moment, with even their own insurers declining to quote for Range Rovers. In an article I read yesterday they have been forced to bring out a 'fix' which makes them more secure, which they say they will retro fit to older models. Whether this 'fix' will sort the problem permanently remains to be seen.

[DTR]

On 1/9/2024 at 8:54 PM, philip42h said:

We renewed with LV= last October, no problem and decent rates; now they won't provide a quote ... 😉 

Seems to be a lack of consistency. I’ve just renewed my policy for my Lexus ES with LV. Price risen from £460 to £700. Several reports of Can Bus thefts on the Lexus forum.

[PJR77]

1 hour ago, DTR said:

Seems to be a lack of consistency. I’ve just renewed my policy for my Lexus ES with LV. Price risen from £460 to £700. Several reports of Can Bus thefts on the Lexus forum.

Probably a case of fewer Lexus ES cars compared with C-HRs.

[Richard 1955]

On 1/8/2024 at 6:55 PM, mizunoman said:

I'm due to take ownership of a new C-HR and went to get an insurance update from my current Corolla. Neither the RAC nor any companies through Compare the Market and Confused could offer insurance. Anyone else experiencing problems?

Yes I am in the same position. I tried comparison sites and got one single quote for over two thousand pounds. Tried Toyota insurance also they were quite unhelpful but quoted exactly the same price as the comparison site.

[Chas G]

On 1/18/2024 at 2:12 PM, DTR said:

Seems to be a lack of consistency. I’ve just renewed my policy for my Lexus ES with LV. Price risen from £460 to £700. Several reports of Can Bus thefts on the Lexus forum.

My sister bought a new, top of the range land-rover discovery.

I can't remember exactly  how much she paid for it but it was more than £70k and I do recall thinking it was a hell of a lot.

She had it for 3 weeks before it was stolen off the drive,  never to be seen again, while they were watching TV about 20ft from it.

 

[Haliotis]

How much ongoing research do the car manufacturers engage in the progressively strengthen the security of their vehicles?  Why cannot the OBD ports have dedicated plug-in sockets, in similar manner to anti-theft wheel studs? Surely this would be a positive step towards making life more difficult for the thieves?  For the car owner, a short adaptor lead could be provided so that service engineers could plug in their test equipment.

The car makers should be concentrating on anti-theft development, instead of wasting time on some of the “boys’ toys” they readily promote in order to sell their cars.  What use is any fancy car, if it can easily be stolen? - and the more fancy the car, the more attractive it is to thieves.

[forkingabout]

First generation C-HR is easy enough to secure against CAN invader or OBD port theft methods with an aftermarket security system - you just need someone / a company that knows what their doing with Toyota / Lexus hybrids 😉

 

[V C]

Just bought a Toyota Auris Hybrid last Saturday and yesterday I was sorting out the insurance cover prior to collection of the car. I was disappointed when  LV told me that they would  not insure the car. when I phoned  LV, I was told the underwriters had made this decision but couldn't tell me why. I have been with LV for years and I already have a multi car and house insurance policy with them.  very disappointed with LV

[jthspace]

Does it have keyless entry / push button start?

Toyota are also being targeted according to a recent article in the Sunday Telegraph

[MagicBoy]

All the Auris Mk2 Hybrids have push button start. The range topping Excel has smart entry, which can be disabled in the infotainment screen.

[Paul john]

5 hours ago, MagicBoy said:

All the Auris Mk2 Hybrids have push button start. The range topping Excel has smart entry, which can be disabled in the infotainment screen.

What are the steps to disable smart entry?

[Andy-uk]

Changed our 2023 yaris to a 2023 yaris cross gr sports last Friday, LV changed over insurance no problems  at all.

[Saxmaniac]

Following an earlier post about LV insurance, I've too had the dreaded news that they would really not like my money any more. A few quick quotes reveals that other companies would like this money but an awful lot more 😭

The words from LV mentioned that the Auris is a high theft risk, not mentioning the cat thefts specifically 

[Rhymes with Paris]

Oh dear, mine with LV is due soon too.

It will be interesting to see if the premium on an older car like mine will be doubled or refused.

I suppose the business model now must be not so much the individual risk, but spreading the cost of stupidly inflated claims made by claims companies, marauding thieves nicking cats 🐈 and other car parts.

The so called ,overpriced courtesy cars from repair companies taking months to fix cars, some would call this a scam.

Of course, what will definitely not happen is that policyholders be fairly charged for the risk, and the crims and scammers and shyster lawyers/claim companies that all cause these huge costs, having to pay for them.

 

 

[FROSTYBALLS]

Could try Flow Insurance, which is an online insurer and owned by LV=:

https://portal.flowinsurance.co.uk/journey/show/product/AnnualMotorInsurance/process/nb/numberPlateScan

[Saxmaniac]

I'll give them a try, I had multi car policy with LV but probably will end up with separate policies 

[Wooster]

I

15 hours ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

Could try Flow Insurance, which is an online insurer and owned by LV=:

https://portal.flowinsurance.co.uk/journey/show/product/AnnualMotorInsurance/process/nb/numberPlateScan

I just tried it - garaged at night; 7000 miles a year; one retired driver; 7 years no claims....  "Sorry... we can't insure you."

[Puglet]

Same here, but a few years ago now, we were with LV for good few years, but then premium went sky high  so we moved on. Although over the years no different to other cars and insurance companies, remember many years ago my renewal premium with one insurer was over double though nothing had changed after a few years of similar price, so they just lost the love.  

[Bper]

Whilst insurance premiums has rocketed over the last few years is this more of a Hybrid problem due to the higher repair costs involved.

If not then we are heading towards a a dark place for many motorists, ownership for most people is essential but this may well become unaffordable if these insurance costs keep rising.

The EV market will also potentially crash if insurers refuse cover or make it unaffordable .☹️