Toyota announces details of the bZ4X (29.10.21)

[Corolla2004]

What fall back capability would the 'steer by wire' system have in the event of a component failure? Toyota/Lexus hybrids use a 'brake by wire' system with a hydraulic pump but a failure causes a reversion to a conventional brake pedal hydraulic piston operation. Could it be that a 'steer by wire' system still needs some sort of mechanical steering column/box etc for back up?

[ernieb]

From my reading of the design there is no mechanical column. I’m sure that the detail will be revelled as time and reviewers get hold of the car.

[AndyRC]

On 11/3/2021 at 6:34 PM, Corolla2004 said:

What fall back capability would the 'steer by wire' system have in the event of a component failure? Toyota/Lexus hybrids use a 'brake by wire' system with a hydraulic pump but a failure causes a reversion to a conventional brake pedal hydraulic piston operation. Could it be that a 'steer by wire' system still needs some sort of mechanical steering column/box etc for back up?

Interesting point 🤔 probably multiple parts/components so that if one fails there is a back up. I’m guessing there is plenty of knowledge out there on “by wire” technology, aren’t most modern commercial aircraft “fly by wire” 🤔.  It will probably have the ability to adjust the feel and weighting of the steering at the touch of a button/screen. It’s definitely one bit of technology  I’m looking forward to trying out, along with one pedal driving.

I’m looking at BEVs with an open mind now the range is getting up to around 300 miles. I have the ability to park/garage/charge at home so the range was the only big question mark I had , along with limited choice. Rather than lament the demise of the ICE I’m looking forward to what BEVs can offer. 

[forkingabout]

Toyota have been using steer by wire on its industrial warehouse equipment since the early 1990's.

Its an extremely reliable system with multiple fail safes built in to the design.

If the system doesn't pass the pre start check OR fails in operation, it applies the brakes until the vehicle stops then locks out the traction. 

The latest design has a tactile feedback device attached to the back of the steering wheel to add various degrees of weighting to the steering feel depending on the speed of vehicle. 

 

[olddriver]

On 11/2/2021 at 3:17 PM, AndyRC said:

As a guess I’d say base model around £45k going up to £55/60k for top range/spec. 

What Car says the estimated base model will be £34,500:-

https://www.whatcar.com/news/2022-toyota-bz4x-electric-suv-revealed-price-specs-and-release-date/n23697

[ernieb]

and the AWD starting at around £40K. 

[AndyRC]

6 hours ago, olddriver said:

What Car says the estimated base model will be £34,500:-

https://www.whatcar.com/news/2022-toyota-bz4x-electric-suv-revealed-price-specs-and-release-date/n23697

I hope they are right,  possibly wishful thinking by Autocar  that Toyota will want a BEV which qualifies for the Government Grant, but I’ve not seen anything which makes the bZ4X look basic. If it comes with a range of 280 miles for under £34,500 I’d say it’s looking like very competitive. 

[Yugguy1970]

At that price yes I'd be interested.

My favourite part of driving the rav is when it is EVing, but I don't want to pay 40k.

[ernieb]

It will be interesting to see what the range is going to be for the AWD version I’m real life, based on the 2WD WLTP estimate of 250 miles it would likely not be enough for me. I’d love to be fully EV for many reasons but the real range would have to be better than I guess it’s going to be. Let’s see what happens in a few weeks time when the data is released.

[AndyRC]

I think there will be quite a lot of interest in the bZ4X when it arrives , I’m guessing that most dealers will be getting a demo vehicle 🤔

[HSDish]

Anyone who knows if the bZ4x will come with fully adjustable passenger seat ?

[FROSTYBALLS]

18 minutes ago, HSDish said:

Anyone who knows if the bZ4x will come with fully adjustable passenger seat ?

Probably way too early for specs to be decided

[ernieb]

On 11/3/2021 at 9:41 AM, AndyRC said:

Watching the video showing the “modular” construction maybe they have a different front subframes with conventional steering and steer by wire? 

From what I’ve seen it’s all going to steer by wire I think the design space where the steering column and rack would be has been repopulated.

[HSDish]

49 minutes ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

Probably way too early for specs to be decided

I saw somwhere that there might be more info. about bZ4X in the end of next week

[duncerduncs]

1 hour ago, HSDish said:

I saw somwhere that there might be more info. about bZ4X in the end of next week

The European debut is on the 2nd December (next Thursday) so all will be revealed then!

[HSDish]

3 hours ago, duncerduncs said:

The European debut is on the 2nd December (next Thursday) so all will be revealed then!

Thanks.

Fond this on Toyota Europe Newsroom

World premiere of the all-new Toyota bZ4X

[FROSTYBALLS]

6 minutes ago, HSDish said:

Thanks.

Fond this on Toyota Europe Newsroom

World premiere of the all-new Toyota bZ4X

Just the Toyota Europe version of the Toyota Global announcement of 29/10/21.

[HSDish]

9 minutes ago, FROSTYBALLS said:

Just the Toyota Europe version of the Toyota Global announcement of 29/10/21.

Yes but it confirms 2 dec. debut/premier date

[AndyRC]

On 11/26/2021 at 4:12 PM, ernieb said:

From what I’ve seen it’s all going to steer by wire I think the design space where the steering column and rack would be has been repopulated.

It’s the one feature that is different from other manufacturers offerings which I’m really interested to try but unfortunately it looks as though we will have to wait a while to get it in Europe. Legislation may have to be changed as I believe there is currently a requirement to have a “mechanical” connection in the steering system. I’m sure legislation will catch up now manufacturers are now ready to fit this technology. How “good/bad” it is remains to be seen but one I’m keen to try. 
 

Steer-by-wire system

The bZ4X will be the first production Toyota to offer a steer-by-wire system – One Motion Grip – due for introduction in Europe at a later date. Dispensing with the mechanical linkage between the steering wheel and the front wheels, this electronic system adjusts the tyre angle precisely according to the driver’s intention, and provides more legroom, improving driving position freedom and ease of entry and exit. The traditional steering wheel is replaced with the One Motion Grip-control, making operation smoother and easier, with no need for hand-over-hand turning. Full-lock can be achieved with just a 150-degree turn.

With no physical connection in the system, unnecessary vibration from the tyres is blocked, but the driver still experiences valuable feedback, such as from the road surface. The steering feeling is improved through independent control of the steering torque; steering characteristics can be changed according to the drive mode selected.

[ernieb]

44 minutes ago, AndyRC said:

It’s the one feature that is different from other manufacturers offerings which I’m really interested to try but unfortunately it looks as though we will have to wait a while to get it in Europe. Legislation may have to be changed as I believe there is currently a requirement to have a “mechanical” connection in the steering system. I’m sure legislation will catch up now manufacturers are now ready to fit this technology. How “good/bad” it is remains to be seen but one I’m keen to try. 
 

Steer-by-wire system

The bZ4X will be the first production Toyota to offer a steer-by-wire system – One Motion Grip – due for introduction in Europe at a later date. Dispensing with the mechanical linkage between the steering wheel and the front wheels, this electronic system adjusts the tyre angle precisely according to the driver’s intention, and provides more legroom, improving driving position freedom and ease of entry and exit. The traditional steering wheel is replaced with the One Motion Grip-control, making operation smoother and easier, with no need for hand-over-hand turning. Full-lock can be achieved with just a 150-degree turn.

With no physical connection in the system, unnecessary vibration from the tyres is blocked, but the driver still experiences valuable feedback, such as from the road surface. The steering feeling is improved through independent control of the steering torque; steering characteristics can be changed according to the drive mode selected.

Good to know, I had not seen that but we’ll be able to see how it looks once the reviewers get hold off it and I’m sure YouTube will be awash with comments and opinions.

[AndyRC]

33 minutes ago, ernieb said:

Good to know, I had not seen that but we’ll be able to see how it looks once the reviewers get hold off it and I’m sure YouTube will be awash with comments and opinions.

I think it’s one of those features you would need to spend some time with to see if it’s right for you. I’d definitely want to spend at least an hour with it in mixed conditions to see how I get on. My local dealer was great with our C-HR demo , basically gave us the keys and said come back when you feel you’ve had enough time to make a decision 👍🙂

[ernieb]

Agreed test drive is the way to go but I think that in a year or so you may not have any choice. My dealer was the same as yours gave us the keys and when I asked how long said before they closed that night which would have given us around 6 hours, full tank and 60% charge in the traction Battery.

[AndyRC]

16 minutes ago, ernieb said:

Agreed test drive is the way to go but I think that in a year or so you may not have any choice. My dealer was the same as yours gave us the keys and when I asked how long said before they closed that night which would have given us around 6 hours, full tank and 60% charge in the traction battery.

This is our first Toyota and have to say the all the sales people were great (not something I usually say about main dealers), no rush , no pressure just “we want you to be happy with your choice”.  The steer by wire is probably the most interesting aspect of the bZ4X which would set it apart from everything else , when it’s available. I’m happy to give all the new technology a go and then make a decision. One concern I have is the cockpit of the bZ4X  looks as though it’s been configured to suit the “Yoke” and a conventional wheel may obscure the display , may be unfounded, but until we can actually drive one we won’t know. Worst bit is we may have to wait until 2023/24 to actually try steer by wire🤔

[ernieb]

I’ve seen some YouTube video of the US version without the yoke steering wheel that only looks to be selling in Japan the instrument panel display was completely obscured. It would obviously depend on your setting for the seat, steering wheel etc. but it looked pretty bad to me. Albeit an early prototype but let’s see what the EU and UK get, yoke or standard wheel.

 

[AndyRC]

23 hours ago, ernieb said:

I’ve seen some YouTube video of the US version without the yoke steering wheel that only looks to be selling in Japan the instrument panel display was completely obscured. It would obviously depend on your setting for the seat, steering wheel etc. but it looked pretty bad to me. Albeit an early prototype but let’s see what the EU and UK get, yoke or standard wheel.

 

Everything I’ve read to date says it will be the conventional wheel only in Europe at launch  and the yoke will come later.