Key Vs Rolling Road

[Norfolk n Chance]

That only shows that a chip.... which oddly none of the tuning firms in the UK will use.... gives the same gain as exhaust and backbox....

Can you not accept that no 2 engines are the same and just because you can't get the same dyno results does not mean that it isn't possible on another car??

[-T- Sport]

Sorry chaps. You can believe what you want is under my bonnet.

But since I bought the car, the only Two, TWO! Modifications that may do any sort of power gains is a TTE Backbox and a K&N Typhoon. There's atleast 10 Members on the TOC boards who've seen my car and the mods it has, and will vouch for them.

As Gaz said above, My car has shown over 200BHP on two different Rolling Roads. If you wish to provide the funds for me to go to more, please feel free. But I refuse to spend any more money testing it until after I (If ever) add any more performance increasing parts. Your arguement is starting to become boring. Why can't you just accept the possibility that I have a strong engine? I've been perfectly honest in all my posts when I say I know nothing about the actual Engine. Yes.. I love cars to bits, but do I know jack em about 'em? Very little at all actually! Only what I've learnt from my dad who's worked on cars for years.

Now.. I managed to convince one Skeptic (Farhan), So why do I need to convince you when you're not even from the UK? For all I know they may state that the 2ZZ in Poland has 192BHP. But it may be wrong. Did you know that the 2ZZ in the XRS and Celica GTS in America only has 170bhp? It's dummed down to meet their Emissions laws. How do I know this? I mod on a Forum based in America and many of them owns 2ZZ's, AND! it's posted on numerous websites. This could be one major floors in your 'Searching the world' for a 2ZZ with over 200BHP! In America it certainly will be hard to get over 200 without forced induction. Link for XRS Specs, The newer XRS's dont even use the 2ZZ due to it's emissions being so high. It now uses a 2.4L N/A engine with 158BHP.

As for the above post RE chip tuning. That only says with a chip, doesn't mention any other mods. For all I know if I take my CTS to their place and get it chipped, it may have 215bhp. Again.. Provide me with the funds and I'll happily go test it.. :)

/rant

LAA69 - Now there lies the problem! I don't have a before any mods run! Hence why I say I may possibly have a strong engine from factory.

[LAA69]

LAA69 - Now there lies the problem! I don't have a before any mods run! Hence why I say I may possibly have a strong engine from factory.

Fella, i dont doubt for one moment what you are currently achieving, was just curious on actual gains thats all.

Didn't want you getting the wrong end of the stick so to speak.

Well done is all i can say.....

[-T- Sport]

Sorry Fella if you thought I was being aggressive to you there, I wasn't. Was just trying to answer your question after my rant. hehe.

Maybe it's the '!' that made it sound aggressive? hehe.

Actually starting to wish I did do a before run. But I cba taking off my Backbox again now.. not to mention I sold the original.. lol.

I may go down the porting route once it's warmed up a bit. But maybe the previous owner ported it? No idea! Apparently it was owned by an Ex-Toyota Rep. And there is a mysterious piece of sticky pad left in the right hand ashtray near the steering wheel... So for all I know he could have done something to it before I bought it. Ricc also thinks my Clucth isn't standard.

[farhanali89]

woah....skeptic.....i didnt agree with your first dyno simply for the fact that there were flaws in the graph!!

Having it done from TDI i will not doubt it but.......BUT

your dyno graph is corrected and depending on how it was corrected the figures again would be in the hands of the operator..................there is no WHP figure.

So before you call me a skeptic this is a forum and im disputing the gains with you.....I think its perfectly fine to have a discussion about it.

Kearon im not having a pop at just your graph i mentioned your dyno as you have the most BHP, I just saw a trend that nearly all the runs from minisport all the cars had to much BHP which raises suspicions for people like myself who are possibly more interested in the performance aspect & want to be pin point realistic with what i will later put my money into and what i can expect in terms of gains. It will be a sorry hard loss of money if i went for a full build and then made 210 and you walked in with a typhoon and backbox and made the same power there would be something flawed there as a built engine would be built from the bottom up and it would be new so things like this would make you wonder.

Again "My Friend" has put alot of money into building his 2zz-ge his runs very strong, the built engine has 3k on it and t-sport786 can vouch for it but he made around what your making ............... so of course we will wonder.

[-T- Sport]

Farhan, No disrespect but nearly everybody is a Skeptic, it's not an insult. ;) I only mentioned your name as you were the main person in dispute at the time.

As Paul at TDi says, WHP from a 'Rolling' Road is never going to be too accurate. you need your wheels removed and have it tested through a more accurate method of rods connected to the hubs. TDi just choose not to show WHP on the graph. (Linky to the thing I'm talking about)

I didn't at all mention what my previous result was until after he told me the new results. So it'd seem a bit odd for him to decided to give me results so close to the first test without knowing what they were.

I metnioned afterwards where my first results were done and he knows Rob, the owner of MiniSport very well, and agrees that their RR is more than likely not too far out. Neal the other chap from TDi loves Minis and actually took his cars there on many occasions. Quite a coincidence. haha.

[rallyfan1986]

I may go down the porting route once it's warmed up a bit. But maybe the previous owner ported it? No idea! Apparently it was owned by an Ex-Toyota Rep. And there is a mysterious piece of sticky pad left in the right hand ashtray near the steering wheel... So for all I know he could have done something to it before I bought it. Ricc also thinks my Clucth isn't standard.

What ashtray near the steering wheel?

forget that, im guessing you mean the little box compartment thing

[LAA69]

No no i didnt take it aggresively at all, just didn't want you taking the question the wrong way.

Sorted fella .. ;)

[-T- Sport]

I may go down the porting route once it's warmed up a bit. But maybe the previous owner ported it? No idea! Apparently it was owned by an Ex-Toyota Rep. And there is a mysterious piece of sticky pad left in the right hand ashtray near the steering wheel... So for all I know he could have done something to it before I bought it. Ricc also thinks my Clucth isn't standard.

What ashtray near the steering wheel?

It may not actually be an ashtray, but it's a drop down box (only small) Just right off the steering wheel, under the TRC Button.

Also.. this is interesting.. Following on from my link earlier of the Rototest website... they've actually done a 2005 CTS!! Link

[-T- Sport]

Ok.. I've just downloaded the PDF version so I could see better. After doing that test at the hubs... the WHP was 165. So it looks as though the RR at Minisport was pretty accurate on the CTS.... that or a bloody good guess seen as he'd never even heard of a CTS before.

[Energo]

That only shows that a chip.... which oddly none of the tuning firms in the UK will use.... gives the same gain as exhaust and backbox....

Can you not accept that no 2 engines are the same and just because you can't get the same dyno results does not mean that it isn't possible on another car??

I accept, I see the chart. But it is unnatural - according to the manufacturer's car has 192 HP, may not have 206 HP without any tuning. Air intake does not add 16 HP

[Energo]

That only shows that a chip.... which oddly none of the tuning firms in the UK will use.... gives the same gain as exhaust and backbox....

Can you not accept that no 2 engines are the same and just because you can't get the same dyno results does not mean that it isn't possible on another car??

I accept, I see the chart. But it is unnatural - according to the manufacturer's car has 192 HP, may not have 206 HP without any tuning. Air intake does not add 16 HP.

Must be some other mods.

[KPARRIS-JONES]

Haven't we established that the factory reading was a lie?.....

[-T- Sport]

KP,

I give up argueing.

Unless he wishes to come over from Poland to see for himself I only have Intake and exhaust there's no point in argueing. lol. I've done 2 different Dyno's on two completely different rolling roads with very minimal differances. My car obviously has a hidden Supercharger somewhere. :lol2:

[KPARRIS-JONES]

KP,

I give up argueing.

Unless he wishes to come over from Poland to see for himself I only have Intake and exhaust there's no point in argueing. lol. I've done 2 different Dyno's on two completely different rolling roads with very minimal differances. My car obviously has a hidden Supercharger somewhere. :lol2:

:lol: is the best thing to do now, people just don't want to be wrong!

You must have a mini S/C or something, OR the kit does give the said gains...... I didn't believe it but the dyno is proof......

[Energo]

Haven't we established that the factory reading was a lie?.....

I saw dozens of charts, CTS, in Poland, Germany, Australia, etc. The factory does not give exact figures, generally CTS has a few HP less than 190

[Energo]

Haven't we established that the factory reading was a lie?.....

I saw dozens dyno charts CTS, in Poland, Germany, Australia, etc. The factory does not give exact figures, generally CTS has a few HP less than 190

My car obviously has a hidden Supercharger somewhere.

Maybe not turbine, but 206 HP it's almost kompressor ;)

[tccom]

Haven't we established that the factory reading was a lie?.....

I saw dozens dyno charts CTS, in Poland, Germany, Australia, etc. The factory does not give exact figures, generally CTS has a few HP less than 190

My car obviously has a hidden Supercharger somewhere.

Maybe not turbine, but 206 HP it's almost kompressor ;)

well how come my compressor was dynoed at 239 bhp when i had a 2 1/2" cat back system fitted still has stock air box fitted NO OTHER MOD'S on a new r/r in april 2009? compressor stock fig 219bhp new r/r ain't gonna be 20 bhp wrong,and they commented that it needs better air filter so theres room for improvement.

[farhanali89]

dude you beat the sp upgrade with that figure!

[tccom]

dude you beat the sp upgrade with that figure!

can only tell u whats on paper who says the sp upgrade is 240 it may be 250,260 bhp i ain't in disagreement but my comp goes very well.

[t-sport786]

Sorry chaps. You can believe what you want is under my bonnet.

But since I bought the car, the only Two, TWO! Modifications that may do any sort of power gains is a TTE Backbox and a K&N Typhoon. There's atleast 10 Members on the TOC boards who've seen my car and the mods it has, and will vouch for them.

As Gaz said above, My car has shown over 200BHP on two different Rolling Roads. If you wish to provide the funds for me to go to more, please feel free. But I refuse to spend any more money testing it until after I (If ever) add any more performance increasing parts. Your arguement is starting to become boring. Why can't you just accept the possibility that I have a strong engine? I've been perfectly honest in all my posts when I say I know nothing about the actual Engine. Yes.. I love cars to bits, but do I know jack em about 'em? Very little at all actually! Only what I've learnt from my dad who's worked on cars for years.

Now.. I managed to convince one Skeptic (Farhan), So why do I need to convince you when you're not even from the UK? For all I know they may state that the 2ZZ in Poland has 192BHP. But it may be wrong. Did you know that the 2ZZ in the XRS and Celica GTS in America only has 170bhp? It's dummed down to meet their Emissions laws. How do I know this? I mod on a Forum based in America and many of them owns 2ZZ's, AND! it's posted on numerous websites. This could be one major floors in your 'Searching the world' for a 2ZZ with over 200BHP! In America it certainly will be hard to get over 200 without forced induction. Link for XRS Specs, The newer XRS's dont even use the 2ZZ due to it's emissions being so high. It now uses a 2.4L N/A engine with 158BHP.

As for the above post RE chip tuning. That only says with a chip, doesn't mention any other mods. For all I know if I take my CTS to their place and get it chipped, it may have 215bhp. Again.. Provide me with the funds and I'll happily go test it.. :)

/rant

LAA69 - Now there lies the problem! I don't have a before any mods run! Hence why I say I may possibly have a strong engine from factory.

If your willing to come down to Uxbridge in Middlesex to a place with a reputable dyno (dyno dynamics) i am willing to pay for the dyno runs..??

Let me know as after speaking to a friend who owned a type r it was widely known on the type r forum that TDI's dyno was a little optimistic compared to a dyno dynamics rolling road.

I'd like to add that he did say that Paul Jones (TDI North) is a reputable tuner and the dyno is just a tuning tool and not a reflection on him.

[-T- Sport]

Well according to my friend who also frequents a few different Type-R forums says it's not over optimistic. Why are all the road I visit optimistic? bad choice in garages I guess!

Anyways.. Though your offer to pay for the Dyno's is generous...somehow I think a 400 Mile round trip is gonna cost me a wedge in fuel... so unless you're willing to pay that... screw that trip! haha.

I'll be attending the next RR day no matter where it's located anyway, so we'll see what a third road has to say.

[Norfolk n Chance]

Key unless you use a rolling road that says you only have 189bhp then your results will always be 'optimistic' to some....

As for Dyno Dynamics being 'reputable' why go all the way to Middlesex when there's plenty in the North???

Unless Northern dyno's are all optimistic?

[KPARRIS-JONES]

Key unless you use a rolling road that says you only have 189bhp then your results will always be 'optimistic' to some....

As for Dyno Dynamics being 'reputable' why go all the way to Middlesex when there's plenty in the North???

Unless Northern dyno's are all optimistic?

They're just happier people. ;)

[t-sport786]

The offer stands if your up for it....will be able to get a few cars so can make a day of it.

As for fuel itl cost you £60 odd willing to contribute £30 odd and pay for the Dyno....

Reason being for me asking you to come down to this one is because i know the dyno is calibrated regularly