Dealership Scammed me on Brake Fluid Change

[SB1500]

Update:  Site Manager at the dealership called me. He shares my concern, he said although naturally they need to have a level of trust in their technicians, he also understands where I'm coming from and if the dealership was to lie about things like this, he would want to know.  

He's asked me to come down next week after work with the bottle of fluid that I got out of the car when doing it to take a sample. I think given that I've changed it that's fair and I believe his authenticity in his concern having also seen the photos / videos and I presume he's also thinking "this customer might be correct" .. 

My only concern is, as the fluid was changed early 2022, would the fluid still potentially register as 'fine'? Since I am changing it slightly under 25k / under two years.   He reckons there's a reason Toyota states 2 years and that fluid in and that my 'old ' stuff should definitely register as deteriorated with their tester. Can anyone comment if that's true? 

[Stivino]

3 minutes ago, SB1500 said:

would the fluid still potentially register as 'fine

Yes

[SB1500]

11 hours ago, Stivino said:

Yes

So essentially, I can go down there, they test it, it appears fine.  But may still be that old, non changed stuff. 
 

it doesn’t prove or answer why the brakes weren’t touched at all in the alleged ‘replacement bleed’ job that I claim hasn’t been done, that they claim has.  
 

the burden of proof is on them, as the knowledgeable and professional party though, right? 

[Avensis tourer]

How about CCTV? 

[avensis_2018]

 2 years and that fluid is fine, my corolla 2019 never change this fluid also my avensis i change only what under the hood 400ml every some mounts alone, never change it in the garage.

work fine, i heard some that clime that you don't need to change it at all, some say you should every 5 years. i do it for my own, its cheap and fast as a maintenance.

 

[Mjolinor]

It's never necessary until you boil it because of the water content and by then it is too late and very very scary. 🙂

 

[Roy124]

On 12/6/2023 at 10:28 AM, Stivino said:

Yes

No.

Brake fluid is hyrdoscopic.  Two year old fluid will be quite different. 

[Stivino]

3 hours ago, Mjolinor said:

It's never necessary until you boil it because of the water content and by then it is too late and very very scary. 🙂

 

Nobody is going to boil the water their brake fluid driving to their work and back.🤣

[Stivino]

10 minutes ago, Roy124 said:

No.

Brake fluid is hyrdoscopic.  Two year old fluid will be quite different. 

I think I know the properties of brake fluid, thank you very much.

[+Steve]

I have had to complain 3 times from 3 different dealers about stuff not being fitted when it was invoiced for. You did the right thing and check. I now check everything that was invoiced for before leaving.

There was also another time when the wife bought an aygo and the wheel bolts had surface corrosion. As part of the deal they were to replace them.. but nope.. they wire brushed them. So.. always check the work.

 

[Mjolinor]

1 hour ago, Stivino said:

Nobody is going to boil the water their brake fluid driving to their work and back.🤣

I think that unless you have actually suffered from it you would be surprised just how easily it does boil

One hard brake action from speed and next time you apply the brakes they are just not there at all.

[Roy124]

3 hours ago, Stivino said:

I think I know the properties of brake fluid, thank you very much.

Getting a bit techy there Stephen.   My NO was a direct disagreement to your YES.

The hygroscopic comment was for Shane.

And I agree with John's comment.  

 

[Stivino]

2 hours ago, Mjolinor said:

I think that unless you have actually suffered from it you would be surprised just how easily it does boil

One hard brake action from speed and next time you apply the brakes they are just not there at all.

This is a wild guess, but I'm figuring that you don't know the slightest thing about braking systems.

[Mjolinor]

50 minutes ago, Stivino said:

This is a wild guess, but I'm figuring that you don't know the slightest thing about braking systems.

Wrong (again).

I would be quite interested in why you assume that given the facts I have posted.

 

[+Toyota Owners Club]

Please try to keep the topic on subject chaps!

The long and short of it is that brake fluid is grossly underestimated in a vehicle and is subject to water content which can boil off when subjected to high temperatures.
When I owned my garage business I used to measure for both water content and boiling point which would show a degradation of the fluid over time.
As an MG Rover specialist garage (I know - someone had to work on them) the manufacturers specified every two years for replacement.
However, it is all well and good just removing it from the calipers, cylinders, etc but the big problem was where the fluid is sat in the ABS system and stayed there for a considerable amount of time if the ABS was never invoked. Problems such as corrosion of the valve block internally and seized internal components due to the moisture in the fluid.
To properly bleed a braking system would require a diagnostic tool/platform that you could run the ABS pump to purge the fluid through the modulator block and fill with fresh.
A lot of motorbikes have this requirement as subjected to harsher conditions on the fluid over time. Some you just do not want to touch (BMW was mentioned earlier and can be a complete nightmare without the proper kit).

The moral of the story is if you are going to replace the brake fluid then it needs to be done to the manufacturer's specifications/method otherwise you could be in for a hiding if it goes wrong.

[Stivino]

54 minutes ago, Mjolinor said:

Wrong (again).

I would be quite interested in why you assume that given the facts I have posted.

 

Because the facts you have posted are nonsense.  Are you certified to talk about brakes?

[Stivino]

13 minutes ago, Toyota Owners Club said:

Please try to keep the topic on subject chaps!

The long and short of it is that brake fluid is grossly underestimated in a vehicle and is subject to water content which can boil off when subjected to high temperatures.
When I owned my garage business I used to measure for both water content and boiling point which would show a degradation of the fluid over time.
As an MG Rover specialist garage (I know - someone had to work on them) the manufacturers specified every two years for replacement.
However, it is all well and good just removing it from the calipers, cylinders, etc but the big problem was where the fluid is sat in the ABS system and stayed there for a considerable amount of time if the ABS was never invoked. Problems such as corrosion of the valve block internally and seized internal components due to the moisture in the fluid.
To properly bleed a braking system would require a diagnostic tool/platform that you could run the ABS pump to purge the fluid through the modulator block and fill with fresh.
A lot of motorbikes have this requirement as subjected to harsher conditions on the fluid over time. Some you just do not want to touch (BMW was mentioned earlier and can be a complete nightmare without the proper kit).

The moral of the story is if you are going to replace the brake fluid then it needs to be done to the manufacturer's specifications/method otherwise you could be in for a hiding if it goes wrong.

You don't say.

[Mjolinor]

48 minutes ago, Stivino said:

Because the facts you have posted are nonsense.  Are you certified to talk about brakes?

 

Nope, not certified at all, are you?

I am qualified to talk about brakes and relate the facts to you and having suffered from boiling brake fluid, I can comment on what happens with 100% reliability.

As we are talking about brake fluid you could keep it on topic and relate what happens in your experience, when brake fluid boils.

 

[+Steve]

you were warned about keeping it on topic, but bickering continued so I am locking this thread.