2022 RAV4 stolen

[ernieb]

One question still not fully answered yet “are all PHEV models immune or is it just the most recent models”?

[nlee]

Maybe the optimist in me, and I certainly don't want to tempt fate with anyone, but does it feel like the rate of reported theft has decreased?

About 12-18 months ago, it was fairly alarming to see reports on this forum and other Facebook groups. Maybe someone in a group, or someone they knew of had a vehicle taken about every couple of weeks. This thread was started on Sept 2022, and although there continues to be lots of active discussion about plates, insurance, etc., I don't recall many recent reports of theft. It's similar on other forums I occasionally track. I appreciate there's a lot of owners that aren't members of such groups.

Not sure why there would be a drop off. Could be plates, steering wheel locks, or maybe some of the gangs have been caught, or their devices have failed. Or maybe they isn't as much demand of theft to order. Meanwhile, other Land Rover and Range Rover groups still have reports 2 or 3 times a week. Similar for some Fords.

[forkingabout]

3 minutes ago, nlee said:

Maybe the optimist in me, and I certainly don't want to tempt fate with anyone, but does it feel like the rate of reported theft has decreased?

The thieves far to busy stealing Lexus vehicles for higher rewards, IIRC 3 disappeared from Lexus forum members last week. 

 

[Dushio]

On 12/29/2023 at 4:56 PM, Nick72 said:

Wow this thread is still going and still continues to be informative. Thank you. I learned about Toyota protection plates! Sounds like a reasonable solution and price.

My take on all this is security is a layered process. Like an onion. You add layers. And just like the safety swiss cheese model you avoid the holes in your cheese slice lining up with one on the next slice.

Feels like the most affordable and visible physical security deterrent is a big hardened steel steering wheel lock. I've got one of these following @ernieb recommendations. It's a good lock although you got to put the key in fully and wiggle or you'll get into a panic as I once did struggling to get it off the steering wheel when I was literally in the middle of nowhere. Operator incompetence I suspected.

Anything physical that's under the surface or anything electrical (like another immobilizer) or anything cyber related (like encryption on the CANbus which quite frankly should be a standard thing these days since it has been cheaply doable for ten or fifteen years) needs to be advertised to the thief. Otherwise they're just going to make a mess of the car until they realise it's not coming with them.

I left the Merc (AMG) in lots of dodgy places. Only time I had a problem was actually parked outside my own house. End of a quiet cul de sac in a nice area. They got in using the transponder relay method. They took a few quid in coins but didn't take some expensive items like a laser torch etc. Unfortunately for them they couldn't start it. In return one of them had blown their nose all over the backs of the front seats and wiped snot everywhere. I could only assume they weren't car to order car thieves but just opportunists having bought a gadget from eBay and looking what they could steal from inside a lot of people's cars.

Never had an issue with the RAV. And I've left it in some pretty dodgy spots in Manchester, Liverpool, Glasgow, plus some other places in the North, and Bristol, Oxford and Swindon. On the road and in makeshift unattended car parks. Always had the steering lock on and nothing on display. Possibly lucky. But at the same time, because it's a company car, I take much more risk in where I leave it, to boost my convenience. And do it a lot. 

That all said, I'd sooner not have the hassle of filling out the paperwork, claiming for my mountaineering and survival gear in the boot and elsewhere, and waiting months for a replacement RAV. 

If it were my own car I'd paid for with a long term vested interest in it and insurance to worry about, I'd definitely...

 

A. Be careful where I left it.

B. Put deterrent cameras up on the house if it were outside.

C. Put a big easily visible steering lock on it.

D. Fit all manufacturer recommended measures. Protection plates and possibly a seperate immobiliser, provided it didn't cause issues and didn't cost more than 400 quid.

E. Put stickers in the window of a really angry version of me choking someone out whilst putting a Japanese short sword though another assailant's stomach.

 

I wonder what they've done on the GR Sport PHEV if anything to fix these issues? Since I'll be swapping from the 2021 R4P to one of these in August. Curious only. Doesn't make a difference to me. I'll just put the steering lock on.

Absolutely spot on.
Thanks as well by the way to the person on this forum that quoted / repeated the Toyota Uk Customer service email address. 
I used the email address, very swift positive response and my plates will be fitted by my local Toyota dealer as soon as I book it in for £70. 

[George22]

22 minutes ago, Dushio said:

Absolutely spot on.
Thanks as well by the way to the person on this forum that quoted / repeated the Toyota Uk Customer service email address. 
I used the email address, very swift positive response and my plates will be fitted by my local Toyota dealer as soon as I book it in for £70. 

 

[kucyk]

14 hours ago, ernieb said:

One question still not fully answered yet “are all PHEV models immune or is it just the most recent models”?

All RAV4 Primes since the first one left the assembly line back in 2021 come with TSK, so I can't imagine it's any different for PHEVs.

[Torrox]

I have had an answer from Toyota customer service regarding the anti can bus steel plates. Copied word for word from their email as it's too small to attach in picture. This explains why my RAV4 GR Sport PHEV doesn't have steel plates fitted and a less worrying for RAV4 PHEV owners.

Quote

Good morning 

Thank you for getting in touch.

Your vehicle has a number of theft deterrent devices, an immobiliser, intrusion alarm, motion sensor alarm and tilt detection sensors. The protection plates that have been offered have been designed for RAV4 models only. RAV4 PHEV models are not susceptible to the can bus attack method and therefore do not require the protection plates.

I hope this eases your concern raised and thanks for contacting Toyota GB

Kind regards.

 

[Dushio]

Ooooooh, I wonder how much a PHEV Badge costs? Is it less than £70 for the plates? 
Will thieves know that PHEV models cannot be attacked via the Canbus (before) they rip off the wheel arch?

Actually (joking aside), I think that Customer Service at Toyota GB have been very helpful indeed and I would certainly recommend anyone contact them if they are experiencing a poor response from staff at a local dealer. My RAV4 HEV gives 50mpg every time with little effort and I’m very pleased with it. 

[Torrox]

1 hour ago, Dushio said:

Ooooooh, I wonder how much a PHEV badge costs? Is it less than £70 for the plates? 
Will thieves know that PHEV models cannot be attacked via the Canbus (before) they rip off the wheel arch?

Actually (joking aside), I think that Customer Service at Toyota GB have been very helpful indeed and I would certainly recommend anyone contact them if they are experiencing a poor response from staff at a local dealer. My RAV4 HEV gives 50mpg every time with little effort and I’m very pleased with it. 

Have you had the plate fitted? My dealership even mentioned extra alarm for rav4 owners in London.

[Dushio]

My dealer, Hills in Woodford didn’t mention anything about having an alarm fitted. They just confirmed my wish to pay and to have plates fitted. 
For me personally:

Security plates

Big Yellow Steering lock

Disabled auto Car opening on Approach

Warning Stickers of Tracker & Immobiliser on front and rear screens

Blue flashing Solar (pretend Alarm) on Dash

All standard Toyota alarms etc

Thats enough. 

[forkingabout]

1 hour ago, Torrox said:

Have you had the plate fitted? My dealership even mentioned extra alarm for rav4 owners in London.

I'm surprised the dealership even mentioned fitting an extra alarm as the official Toyota UK response has always been fit a GHOST immobiliser 🤣

[Rhymes with Paris]

On 1/18/2024 at 5:28 PM, Dushio said:

My dealer, Hills in Woodford didn’t mention anything about having an alarm fitted. They just confirmed my wish to pay and to have plates fitted. 
For me personally:

Security plates

Big Yellow Steering lock

Disabled auto Car opening on Approach

Warning Stickers of Tracker & Immobiliser on front and rear screens

Blue flashing Solar (pretend Alarm) on Dash

All standard Toyota alarms etc

Thats enough. 

Slavering Bully XL killing machine on the back seat maybe?🙂

Remember to fit waterproof seat covers.

I dunno what the answer is, there have been low life scum stealing cars as long as there have been cars I think.

I have never understood the concept of TWOCing either.

Ie taking without the owners consent, to me that is stealing, I know the theory is the intention to permanently deprive doctrine to meet the legal threshold of theft.

But who would want their cherished car back after some filthy, greasy, Adidas three stripe clad moron had thrashed it along rough roads bouncing the valves out of the bonnet?

That is I reckon permanently depriving the owner of what they had before, it's not the same car anymore.

How about a car thieves march now in the middle of winter from Manchester to London, they could wear luminous green vests for visibility, with "I am a car thief" in big red letters emblazoned on them, followed by 20 years in the Scrubs.

Nothing Draconian of course , they would be allowed to rest for 20 mins every 6 hours, and given veg waste soup.

To please the bleeding hearts, I could mention that my uncle did a similar march from Dunkirk to Germany, and never stole anything in his life, AFAIK, and had his teeth knocked out with a rifle butt for daring to mention that this was outside the Geneva convention.

[P_J]

On 1/18/2024 at 2:19 PM, Torrox said:

I have had an answer from Toyota customer service regarding the anti can bus steel plates. Copied word for word from their email as it's too small to attach in picture. This explains why my RAV4 GR Sport PHEV doesn't have steel plates fitted and a less worrying for RAV4 PHEV owners.

Exactly what I received Torrox. 
Some peace of mind at least. 

[FROSTYBALLS]

Most stolen cars of 2023 -

 

[Rigsby]

Looks as though Jaguar Landrover (who have had major issues with vehicle theft) are doing upgrades Free of Charge.

[forkingabout]

The official Toyota / Lexus fix for certain vulnerable products is the protection plates to stop thieves accessing the connector - their just very slow to inform customers about them being available & roll them out.

 

[robo1]

There’s no mention of the Jaguar/ Land Rover owners having to pay for the update unlike Toyota owners.  (unless it’s all software changes )

[FROSTYBALLS]

JLR security updates:

"JLR’s investment includes updates to the Body Control Module (BCM) which prevents thieves driving away a vehicle without a key.

Criminals have previously hacked the keyless entry system enabling them to start the engine but JLR’s updates contain embedded technology to prevent this." 

The updates bring pre 2022 vehicles up to a similar security standard to those produced from 2022.

[ELD1970]

 To cut a long story very short the Ghost 2 kept messing up the hybrid system so had it removed and replaced with a Laserline Guardian 361THT. Comes with encrypted blue tooth fobs so car won’t start unless you are in it. Thatcham approved and happy with it. 

[forkingabout]

I have seen it mentioned on the Lexus forum about issues with Ghost & the ES hybrid, Autowatch apparently looking in to it. 

Toyota / Lexus hybrids can be extremely difficult to successfully immobilise without causing issues with the hybrid system, or the fitter just gets lazy & cuts the push to start button circuit which is a total waste of time as the CAN invader theft method bypasses that button 🤣

 

 

[ELD1970]

It will stop the relay method where they grab your keys transmit code and steal your car. The headlight plates should deal with the CANBUS issue….and my Stoplock Pro Elite steering lock 😊

[kucyk]

2 hours ago, ELD1970 said:

It will stop the relay method where they grab your keys transmit code and steal your car.

Not really needed on 2021+? Hybrid and PHEV (the ones with a new fob type)

[ELD1970]

Mines a 2020 so probably helpful with mine.

[Dm800]

Just in process of insurance renewal. Current insurers ( major company)not interested in the fact I have the can bus anti theft plates fitted. Not on their system apparently.

[Dushio]

Just had my Canbus plates fitted to my 2019 RAV4. No drama, the car was ready within 3 hours and the Toyota dealer was very good. Has anyone who has had the plates fitted had a sticker or something fitted to the windscreen to say plates fitted?

I continue to use big yellow Stoplock at all times and recommend that everyone else does even if they have a new style key fob. All the latest Range Rovers and BMW’s plus Mercs parked around this part of East London have the Stoplock on which is good to see but a sad indictment of this area.